RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

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mccracke
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RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#1 » Post by mccracke » 03 Dec 2017 02:39

Hello all,

I have two suggestions and I'll separate them as such.

1) It would be extremely helpful and encouraging for RDF (specifically queuing for a 'Random Dungeon') for that group to not have a dungeon ID saved after completing the run. It would allow everyone to queue for RDF even if they're saved to specific dungeons, and won't limit the people that are queued to only dungeons that haven't already been completed. Queue times could greatly benefit with this change. Additionally, I believe this will really help fresh 70 players gear up for raids, something that has been a struggle as of late.

2) Second suggestion is to add the BiS heroic epic gems to a Badge (and Honor) vendor(s) for prices that will not be abused. Something like 50 Badges for one Gem seems reasonable (I don't know Honor quantities to make a remark about it), maybe more if people feel 50 is too low. I greatly believe it would encourage even BiS geared people and reinvigorate heroic activity substantially on Primal. Everyone can get something out of a heroic this way. Everyone needs those gems, regardless how long you've been on the server.

Thank you!

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Beldex
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#2 » Post by Beldex » 03 Dec 2017 02:45

Both of those seem reasonable. Have been many a time I've seen someone advertise for 1 more for a specific dungeon but I already did it for the day.

The gem thing would have to be tweaked to determine prices.

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Nyeriah
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#3 » Post by Nyeriah » 03 Dec 2017 04:49

1) That is actually a bug. We had heroic RDF working that way before, but it was not reimplemented at some point.

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Dunkelstein
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#4 » Post by Dunkelstein » 03 Dec 2017 10:46

If you make gems available for Badges I'm afraid that people will skip the harder dungeons that are supposed to drop their gems, and specificly do only the quick dungeons.

I would prefer uncut gems for Honor like in wotlk, and maybe also for badges. That way we also don't screw over jewelcrafters, they still get to use their recipes.
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Relina
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#5 » Post by Relina » 03 Dec 2017 11:20

No need to add gems to Badge/Honor Vendor.
1) Fix bug with heroic RDF.
2) And increase drop chance of gems to say ~33% for all the initial bosses and ~66% for final boss of the dungeon.
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lrctgl
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#6 » Post by lrctgl » 03 Dec 2017 12:57

Relina wrote:
03 Dec 2017 11:20
No need to add gems to Badge/Honor Vendor.
1) Fix bug with heroic RDF.
2) And increase drop chance of gems to say ~33% for all the initial bosses and ~66% for final boss of the dungeon.
im more onboard with this seeing as right now the gems almost never drop which is why i think some people gave up on farming them

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mccracke
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#7 » Post by mccracke » 03 Dec 2017 14:40

Dunkel the normal gem cuts aren't the same as the heroic drops tho. The heroic drop ones are BiS right now. I like the idea of buffing the drop rate, but don't make it crazy :O Even better maybe, keep the drop rate the same on all lesser bosses and just make the last boss drop one gem guaranteed, or even two if you're "lucky".

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Dunkelstein
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#8 » Post by Dunkelstein » 03 Dec 2017 16:13

mccracke wrote:
03 Dec 2017 14:40
Dunkel the normal gem cuts aren't the same as the heroic drops tho. The heroic drop ones are BiS right now.
Yes
Dunkelstein wrote:
03 Dec 2017 10:46
That way we also don't screw over jewelcrafters, they still get to use their recipes.
If you offer raw gems instead, people will still do the specifics they are supposed to but won't leave with empty hands for helping in other dungeons. Crafted gems are still really good and expensive.

We can't just delete Jewelcrafting like that, not after some put so much effort into getting recipes.
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mccracke
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#9 » Post by mccracke » 04 Dec 2017 06:26

I don't want the quantity to be overwhelming at all like that. They shouldn't be easy enough that people have full heroic gems in their gear in lets say 1 or 2 weeks of farming (from none). Should take ~10 heroics to get one gem. I rly don't think that'll kill JC. But it gives us BiS raiders something to do and for purpose to destroy creatures in all of the LOVELY (no sarcasm) scripted heroic dungeons (seriously all these heroics are scripted now, trash packs and all) and deserve to be ran. They're tons of fun and a bit challenging still!

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.Watson1988
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#10 » Post by .Watson1988 » 04 Dec 2017 11:51

I like what Dunkel wrote. Add to the random heroic dungeon reward (not the heroic daily) a rare uncut gem with equal drop chance among colours. The sought after uncut gems like orange and red are very expensive due to dropping so rarely and I think it would help us all if they became a bit less scarce.

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Dunkelstein
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#11 » Post by Dunkelstein » 04 Dec 2017 16:39

Primal Nethers as a currency, like Frozen Orbs in 3.3?
For other Primals, Fel Lotus, Void Crystals/Planar Essence/Prismatic Shards, uncut Gems, maybe even random drop recipes (which are in short supply due to the small pop atm).
These offers would give the economy a boost that is needed imo.
(You can already trade 10 Badges for one Nether at the vendor)

BiS gems would remain rare and precious like they are supposed to. To get the people into dungeons daily who are just after BiS gems, we really just need to populate the queues enough so it's worth for them to queue specific.

Thoughts on Nethers vs Badges, item selection (gems in particular)?
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Numquam
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#12 » Post by Numquam » 04 Dec 2017 19:51

I don't like the Nether as currency idea. Nethers are worth 10 badges or 1/5 per HC, but unlike wrath, you can't spam RHC nonstop here. Even if you could, remember that dungeons are overtuned and thus can't be farmed as easily as wrath ones even with top gear, not counting when you get in with people that are just starting to gear up.

Might aswell make the stuff you need be worth 10 badges than rely on Nethers. If you have no use for them, make them tradeable or give to someone who does need it. Primals aren't that hard to farm either. You are better of farming them from elementals than running a dungeon for a nether.

Now, for world drop recipes that's something I can agree with. Spellstrike and Whitemend are examples of crafts everyone needs but rarely anyone has, or some enchanting recipes that come from rarely done dungeons.

AS FOR GEMS:

I agree that there should be a Badge/Honor to HC gems system. The reason is that you want to have people doing stuff all the time, and the only things to do other than Raids are BGs and RHC, pretty much. It's about giving endgame people reasons to do content, not just to make gems easier to get. YOU WANT PEOPLE DOING STUFF.

I disagree with the Rare Uncut Gem reward. Why? Because then you have people with gold that rather buy from AH the uncut/cut gem and raidlog than actually focusing on getting the best gems. The price of JC gems will go down too, as they would become easier to get.

The idea is that rare gems from JC are the starting gems for people who are gearing up and haven't saved a lot of badges yet, while the "hardcore" players that got all their stuff already can keep farming RHC for the slightly better RHC gems with badges. (For example, a new player has to buy Badge pieces, trinkets and etc and crafting their pre-bis before they would want to put a RHC Gem on it, let alone spend 50 badges on one gem)

You can get gold really easy if you do the right stuff, so offering rare uncut gems makes no difference to the players that already have all their gems on their gear or have the gold to buy them from AH when they change a piece. We want to give players that have all their stuff maxed a reason to be online and doing RHC and earlier content. RHC gems, Fel Lotus and other "rare" things like that are the best way to do it.

Enchanting will become affected too, as more RHC means more enchanting mats and thus lower market prices. So don't complain about JC when the base players that will buy gems remains the same as the "old" raiders don't really buy gems unless they change a piece of gear.

You want to give people a reason to be online doing stuff. BG and RHC are the answer. If you offer as rewards the same things that you can get with just gold, people will just spend their gold or farm it instead of doing stuff. It's easier to farm 50-100g to buy a cut gem from AH than to gather 50 badges for a RHC gem.
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Numquam
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Re: RDF and BiS (until t6) Gems

#13 » Post by Numquam » 08 Dec 2017 17:09

And please...don't disregard BGs from this. Imagine if you could buy Fel Lotus with Honor, for example. People could improve their raid consumes instead of relying in a stupid RNG gather from herbalists that make Lotus 50g a piece and a really rare supply in AH.

As I said before, you want people doing stuff. Give RHC and BG the same possibilities as to get items for their respective currencies (badges and honor points) and not just empower PvE while killing PvP. I mean it.
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