[Rejected] Create PvP server?

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Zanmato
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Re: Create PvP server?

#31 » Post by Zanmato » 24 Aug 2015 12:21

Prime wrote:A test at this point is actually a surprisingly reasonable suggestion because population has been stable lately.

Setting it to PvP from 2 September until 16 September shouldn't do any permanent harm while doing something for the PvPers.
If we can't hit a 550 peak (10% increase) during that time then it will stay PvE and everyone will need to give up on this entire PvE vs PvP discussion.
If we hit that mark then the test will be extended. If it's clear that long-term population will benefit more with a PvP server then we will need to admit that it's better to permanently make it PvP.

During that time I would also check if the average population is actually increasing and check opinions from outside of the community to see if PvP is the real reason that population increased instead of the extra raid content.

If it would get to the point of switching to PvP then I would feel sad for those who only joined because of PvE. But if they already reached level 60 then we can only hope that the change would be less painful for them and they understand the population benefits.

Sounds reasonable enough?
Would you mind posting something on the homepage, or adding to the current news post regarding September 2nd ? Want to link people to an actual confirmation post regarding this test when advertising on reddit and such.

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EbonTopaz
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Re: Create PvP server?

#32 » Post by EbonTopaz » 24 Aug 2015 12:25

EbonTopaz wrote:You do of course realise that the significant majority of PvP fanatics will either multibox or create alt accounts en masse to try and break the 550 peak limit?

I say, either keep a very good eye on this and ban players for attempting to rig the system, or solely look at the amount of active level 60's. It's much more difficult to rig that way, like they have been attempting at every single PvP-related poll on this forum.
Just re-posting this so people will be more likely to see it.

Because trust me, this will happen.
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Hushness

Re: Create PvP server?

#33 » Post by Hushness » 24 Aug 2015 12:25

I don't post often on these forums, but this kind of warrants a post.

You're nothing if not unpredictable, Prime. I'll give you that. Given what seemed to be your firm resolve to keep it PvE previously, I'm a bit surprised your're opting for this solution when there was a couple of good ones mentioned earlier that catered to both camps. But it's easier this way I suppose. In the end, if it helps the server I guess you have no choice. An added bonus would probably be silencing the massively self-entitled morons (from both camps) who couldn't hold on to a proper discussion to save their life. Anyway, best of luck.
Last edited by Guest on 24 Aug 2015 12:32, edited 1 time in total.

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Zanmato
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Re: Create PvP server?

#34 » Post by Zanmato » 24 Aug 2015 12:31

EbonTopaz wrote:
EbonTopaz wrote:You do of course realise that the significant majority of PvP fanatics will either multibox or create alt accounts en masse to try and break the 550 peak limit?

I say, either keep a very good eye on this and ban players for attempting to rig the system, or solely look at the amount of active level 60's. It's much more difficult to rig that way, like they have been attempting at every single PvP-related poll on this forum.
Just re-posting this so people will be more likely to see it.

Because trust me, this will happen.
Active 60s should have nothing to do with this, cause some people might actually wanna give this server a chance if it swaps to PvP. While only a test, people who have refused to play here before for the lack of world pvp might actually give it a chance now.

Your point regarding fake multiboxing accounts is valid though, i'm sure Prime will filter out duplicate IP's when analysing data.

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Fice94
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Re: Create PvP server?

#35 » Post by Fice94 » 24 Aug 2015 12:32

1. Player who leveling there first toon will quit cuz ganking in strangelthorn and cry on World
2. Ganking people on Summon Stones will happen, raids will be delayed
3. Multiboxer will come
4. Population will decrease (well first week it will go up cuz new pve content)
5. PvP qeues will be still the Same waiting time

You can Quoute me after the 2 Week test
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Analya
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Re: Create PvP server?

#36 » Post by Analya » 24 Aug 2015 12:39

Prime wrote:The decision was already made about this: http://www.primalwow.org/forum/viewtopi ... 26#p176432

Changing the server to PvP won't increase population, it would only decrease due to current players leaving. Blaming us that we don't want to increase population is just unbelievable, of course we want it to increase. But creating another server would only split population which is not that easy to recover from as you think. Besides, we already have TrueWoW as PvP server, just a little bit different mechanics at high levels.

Our goal is progression which is all about PvE. PvP mechanics won't change at all during the entire Vanilla phase. Many players don't want to be forced into PvP. They would join a BG if they really wanted that, this is even more true on a PvE server. But seeing the amount of people who queue for a BG, it's clear that only a minority is interested in PvP.

Players will only end up disagreeing with each other. Nothing will change if there is no agreement on what's best for the server. I am afraid this thread will also be closed as soon as the discussion turns into a flame war. If new players see people insulting each other at the forums, that's what really turns them away from the server.

Basically he stated that it will remain PvE realm and there's no further discussion on the subject and ... RIP

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EbonTopaz
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Re: Create PvP server?

#37 » Post by EbonTopaz » 24 Aug 2015 12:48

Zanmato wrote:
EbonTopaz wrote:
EbonTopaz wrote:You do of course realise that the significant majority of PvP fanatics will either multibox or create alt accounts en masse to try and break the 550 peak limit?

I say, either keep a very good eye on this and ban players for attempting to rig the system, or solely look at the amount of active level 60's. It's much more difficult to rig that way, like they have been attempting at every single PvP-related poll on this forum.
Just re-posting this so people will be more likely to see it.

Because trust me, this will happen.
Active 60s should have nothing to do with this, cause some people might actually wanna give this server a chance if it swaps to PvP. While only a test, people who have refused to play here before for the lack of world pvp might actually give it a chance now.

Your point regarding fake multiboxing accounts is valid though, i'm sure Prime will filter out duplicate IP's when analysing data.
I mentioned the active level 60's, due to the amount of level 60 players that have supposedly quit due to the lack of PvP. Seeing how many of them would return would be a much more accurate indication.

I definitely do hope Prime will filter the duplicate IP's and take swift and decisive action if too many people end up trying to exploit it. Like, give all players who try to multibox during the test a two-week ban or something, and remove all accounts that don't have at least one level 6+ character within 24 hours of its creation.

And if too many people try to use these kinds of abuses in the first three to four days, just cancel the trial entirely.
Fice94 wrote:1. Player who leveling there first toon will quit cuz ganking in strangelthorn and cry on World
2. Ganking people on Summon Stones will happen, raids will be delayed
3. Multiboxer will come
4. Population will decrease (well first week it will go up cuz new pve content)
5. PvP qeues will be still the Same waiting time

You can Quoute me after the 2 Week test
I am confident all of these things will happen in a small to significant degree.

I predict multiboxing Warlocks and Rogues camping Summon Stones will be especially common.
Analya wrote:Basically he stated that it will remain PvE realm and there's no further discussion on the subject and ... RIP
Prime confirmed that there will be a two-week trial period with PvP on starting on the 2nd of September.
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.Abcynia
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Re: Create PvP server?

#38 » Post by .Abcynia » 24 Aug 2015 12:49

Simply hitting a 550 person peak shouldn't be held as conclusive evidence for the need to switch to PvP. You should also add the requirement for those characters to have actively achieved levels that would demonstrate new players actually joining the server and not 15 or 20 multi-boxers just logging in new accounts.
After 2 weeks of new people joining the server, their toon should be at least level 40 - perhaps exclude any new accounts below that from your total.
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nicola95
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Re: Create PvP server?

#39 » Post by nicola95 » 24 Aug 2015 13:09

@Prime , Okay Prime, you really shouldn't have said about that 550 player cap because now all the hardcore (not all of them but the whiny ones) PvErs will quit the server on purpose, just to make sure it stays the same. I am from the best Ally guild, (no offence guys...we're the best) Mystic, and let me just tell you how HARD and FRUSTRATING it is to try kill Thrall while a bunch of scardy Hordes stay all around you and just wait you to get low on HP so they can start killing your raid. Also prisets can freely mind-control you without getting flagged as PvP, and you can imagine what happens when your tanks get mind-controlled and you can't do anything but do your best of healing/dps. Also...the crossfraction thing must really be turned off now. We have enough players like on Ally and on Horde to pull our own raids...cause really like one of Mystics officers said "Seeing a Horde with Paladin buffs, makes me throw up". And least but not last it is really making me angry (and I'm sure many others) the fact that while you're leveling a toon and you see an opposite fractioned player getting your quest item or killing your quest targets...guess what...you can't do anything once more....because he will never turn his PvP on and all you can do is swear infront of the monitor like a retard. Sorry if this post is being a little bit more aggressive but I and many more I'm sure are a bit tired of this.Yes, we cry about wanting PvP but at the end of the story even if it does stay PvE many of us will stay...but will this be the same with PvErs if the server goes PvP...I don't think so. Cheers!

P.S I think that crossfraction is not even close to vanilla-like. Okay...we didn't have much players back then..we had some fun...it's time to go. Prime, you want a progression server on 3.3.5, we want a progression server on 3.3.5, lets all try and make it better. :) I don't say the project is bad. It's amazing and I'm loving every day spent with my guild raiding and having fun, but apart from that i am PvP player and i really miss the experience. Like many other said...i care for PvE and PvP equally!

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Roel
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Re: Create PvP server?

#40 » Post by Roel » 24 Aug 2015 13:14

The 550 peak was just one requirement.
Prime wrote:During that time I would also check if the average population is actually increasing and check opinions from outside of the community to see if PvP is the real reason that population increased instead of the extra raid content.
Only we need to bother with detailed conditions to make sure that nothing else interferes with the results. But you may be right that it's better to delay such a test until after the raid releases, to keep that influence to a minimum.

It would be merely so these PvPers have a way to prove that it would have such a drastic effect on the population. The server would have been PvP from the start if I believed that would be the case. But it's true that a test is the only way to find out, they really can't let this discussion die otherwise...

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Sulik
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Re: Create PvP server?

#41 » Post by Sulik » 24 Aug 2015 13:57

Prime wrote:It would be merely so these PvPers have a way to prove that it would have such a drastic effect on the population. The server would have been PvP from the start if I believed that would be the case. But it's true that a test is the only way to find out, they really can't let this discussion die otherwise...
Good luck with that. Those discussions haven't exactly been the triumph of human reasoning.

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nicola95
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Re: Create PvP server?

#42 » Post by nicola95 » 24 Aug 2015 15:10

It would be merely so these PvPers have a way to prove that it would have such a drastic effect on the population. The server would have been PvP from the start if I believed that would be the case. But it's true that a test is the only way to find out, they really can't let this discussion die otherwise...
Why do i have the feeling that you too want the server to stay the same...

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.Venna
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Re: Create PvP server?

#43 » Post by .Venna » 24 Aug 2015 15:11

I think that changing it to PvP for any reason will lose a lot of people who rolled here because it was PvE. And they won't come back. Doing it when raids are coming out muddies the waters and you won't know if ppl came here for raids or PvP.

It's a PvE server, it started PvE, it should remain PvE. If others want PvP, there are SO MANY servers they can go to. Why ruin the one server that decided to be PvE?
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ceh789
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Re: Create PvP server?

#44 » Post by ceh789 » 24 Aug 2015 15:27

@Prime I strongly encourage you to do this test at another time, if you are going to proceed with it. There is absolutely no way to remove the confound of two new raids coming out the same day as you make this change. Since there is a planned 3 month window between releasing new content, I cannot think of a good reason not to put it off for, say a month, to allow the new raids to settle in before attempting to measure the impact of this test.
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Cafecubano
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Re: Create PvP server?

#45 » Post by Cafecubano » 24 Aug 2015 16:02

Venna wrote:I think that changing it to PvP for any reason will lose a lot of people who rolled here because it was PvE. And they won't come back. Doing it when raids are coming out muddies the waters and you won't know if ppl came here for raids or PvP.

It's a PvE server, it started PvE, it should remain PvE. If others want PvP, there are SO MANY servers they can go to. Why ruin the one server that decided to be PvE?
This. Why are you even entertaining the idea to the 4-5 people that constantly wine about it. You have no way to accurately notice an increase in population and will only make the dedicated people that came here leave or willingly not log on. You also cannot do this decision at the release of a new raid because once again the numbers will not be accurate. This will do alot more harm than good. Instead focus on proper advertising and video's to get our unique server known. People are not fighting for WPvP, they are fighting for ganking lowbies in STV, learn the difference.

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