[Rejected] Ban low gear from BG

#1 » Post by **Matsy** » 23 Dec 2015 18:10

With such a low population, the amount of low gear people who join BG and just ruin the entire thing is ridiculous, specially on horde side.

Ban people with below 4k gs from bg, its impossible to do anything when these people join for no reason other than to hamper the ability for that side to win as they get 1shot by anyone.

I'll just add this here:
http://www.tinyurl.com/startpvp

Also stop misinterpreting this.
This is people who join for no other reason other than to hamper the ability for the team to win, that is what pretty much everyone with low gear is doing. Sure there are a few who are actually decent and serve a roll in that bg, but not many.
There are other better ways to get gear quicker than loosing over and over in bg's for the lowbies who want gear, they shouldn't be joining BG's making it harder for the team to win because of them being there not being much use at all.
Farming PoS normal for awhile will net you a full set of furious pvp gear and doesn't take long.

#2 » Post by **benzviliran** » 23 Dec 2015 18:19

im against that because u can gear up quick by joining rbgs, problem is that most of those low geared players dont do that they dont gear they stay low forever and they play bad.

i dont mind if low geared players join but problem is they leave before BG end or stay afk in graveyard so if they wanted honor they wouldnt do so.

giving a GS requirement is bad but its an option but i would consider first other solutions for example get a gm or 2 that their job will be most likely to watch pvp , if a player with low GS is purposly being afk in rbg several times or leaving a BG before it ends(doesnt get extra honor) etc could be suspended from rbgs.

as we know this is a complicated case and forbiddening low gs from rbgs does hurt people who also want to actually pvp and gear fast therefor being creative and catching the problematic is the only way i find valid and effective.

but again it requires the staff willingness to enforce it in the rbgs and this will require 1-2 gms to spend few hours a day watching the pvp system (battlegrounds and arenas).

#3 » Post by **Wilcox** » 23 Dec 2015 18:21

this happens on alliance aswell and it was one of the main reasons I keep going nuts every now and then, i support this. someone that doesn't even have rhc gear shouldn't queue for rbg, it's not blizzlike and all whatever but fuck off with that, population isn't blizzlike

no it wont require watching at all, you simply won't be able to queue for rbg if you're below a certain avg item level

#4 » Post by **Errorista** » 23 Dec 2015 18:29

How about being happy that fresh people keep coming to this server? Everyone had to start with low gear except veterans sticking with updates. Duh.

#5 » Post by **benzviliran** » 23 Dec 2015 18:50

how about being happy with people coming to server and in bgs without low geared players that even after 3 months or more still have same gear or only added 100 gear score ?

we sure are happy with new players but seriously many people just stop queuing or playing cause the rbgs are many times fucked by low geared players on both sides. also with people who dual box but thats something different.

anyway i offered a way i find more convinient that could keep the blizzlike and keep people happy it only depends if the staff is willing to spare a few hours doing so every day .

if not than i would seriously consider matsy solution good, surely the situation is very bad and requires something to be done.

Wilcox is just out of many other players who play here on the server and like rbgs and had to quit couple of times just for that reason, low geared or fresh 80 who simply join and play bad arent being usefull and afk in graveyard or feeding and even leaving before rbg is over.

#6 » Post by **Doctor_J** » 23 Dec 2015 19:19

This is also partly Blizzards fault for forcing players who never usually pvp to pvp to get meta achieemet for events, it always happens when theres an event with a pve element.

#7 » Post by **marisco** » 23 Dec 2015 20:01

Holy shit, I hardly ever comment on any forums but had to login just to say, this is the most retarded, bigoted and entitled idea ever. And this speaks wonders on how the state of pvp is fucked up here. This is the first server I ever played where it's easier to get carried on a heroic 25 man than it is to do some pvp without people whispering you to shit talk about your gear. I was disgusted by the PVP scene here the moment I tried a 80 bg and don't get me wrong, I love TW as much as the next guy and I sincerely think its the best wotlk server out there, but the pvp here is as toxic as it gets. You guys manage to make the MOBA playerbase look like nice guys

The entry barrier on TW's pvp is just RIDICULOUS high already (everyone and their mother is holding a SM here, but thats not the problem right?

) and now you want to actually stop players from entering BG? How are they supposed to get pvp gear? I suppose that you want people to spend frosties on Relentless gear? Ooh, are they supposed to get PVE gear first and join the bgs? This is mind boggling, really. Low-geared people farmind honor for pvp gear is supposed to happen, everyone starts like that SPECIALLY if it's their first char in the server.

BGs are not supposed to be about cookie-cutter builds BiS people waving their e-dicks around each other for bragging rights. You already have arenas for that exact same reason. BGs are supposed to be a fun, pvp enviroment where everyone is welcome just for the sake of it. That's why its not ranked. Thats why its quick. And that's why you don't get BiS pvp gear just from BGs. And what if a player joins with 3k gs and keeps getting one shotted? It's his right to do so, if he finds that acceptable who the fuck are you to tell him otherwise? Your idea to make the pvp community better is to forbid players that you dont want to play with from playing the game? rofl

Maybe the day where you guys are more welcoming and less douchy in regards to pvp here people will feel more encouraged to join bgs on a regular basis. And you know what? Maybe if more people naturally feel confortable enough to join BGs without being ostracized by people like you, then the PVP situation will get better.

#8 » Post by **benzviliran** » 23 Dec 2015 20:15

marisco wrote:Holy shit, I hardly ever comment on any forums but had to login just to say, this is the most retarded, bigoted and entitled idea ever. And this speaks wonders on how the state of pvp is fucked up here. This is the first server I ever played where it's easier to get carried on a heroic 25 man than it is to do some pvp without people whispering you to shit talk about your gear. I was disgusted by the PVP scene here the moment I tried a 80 bg and don't get me wrong, I love TW as much as the next guy and I sincerely think its the best wotlk server out there, but the pvp here is as toxic as it gets. You guys manage to make the MOBA playerbase look like nice guys

The entry barrier on TW's pvp is just RIDICULOUS high already (everyone and their mother is holding a SM here, but thats not the problem right? ) and now you want to actually stop players from entering BG? How are they supposed to get pvp gear? I suppose that you want people to spend frosties on Relentless gear? Ooh, are they supposed to get PVE gear first and join the bgs? This is mind boggling, really. Low-geared people farmind honor for pvp gear is supposed to happen, everyone starts like that SPECIALLY if it's their first char in the server.

BGs are not supposed to be about cookie-cutter builds BiS people waving their e-dicks around each other for bragging rights. You already have arenas for that exact same reason. BGs are supposed to be a fun, pvp enviroment where everyone is welcome just for the sake of it. That's why its not ranked. Thats why its quick. And that's why you don't get BiS pvp gear just from BGs. And what if a player joins with 3k gs and keeps getting one shotted? It's his right to do so, if he finds that acceptable who the fuck are you to tell him otherwise? Your idea to make the pvp community better is to forbid players that you dont want to play with from playing the game? rofl

Maybe the day where you guys are more welcoming and less douchy in regards to pvp here people will feel more encouraged to join bgs on a regular basis. And you know what? Maybe if more people naturally feel confortable enough to join BGs without being ostracized by people like you, then the PVP situation will get better.

i agree with many things that you say, but you do agree that people who join rbgs with 1k hp many times probably do that to get gear?

now if you do agree with me about what i asked above than do you agree that if they join to also get gear they should also stay untill bg end in order to get bonus extra points losing/winning? do you also agree they wont be afk and try to participate in battles or for example use helpfull abillities that it doesnt matter if you have low gear u can still be usefull?

not long ago i created an ally druid, i joined with about 15k hp, when it was warsong i mostly used roots and cycloned pounce etc to cc and slow right targets, helped healers and such.

in AB i just went prowling/stealth and captured camps behind horde backs.

in AV i did the same with towers, in 1 single game (that by the way alliance won) i had 31 towers assaulted and thats with just 20k hp druid, just by doing so i also made over 4-10 horde busy defending just by doing so which allowed my team to advance and capture the front towers.

u do agree with me that if u want to join rbgs and enjoy and get gear you will more likely to participate in it for extra honor?

thats why i think that its not the GS here atleast not most of it and yeah many retards with shadowmournes who play like vengeance and whine about people gear while they play the same as the one they whine about but the solution that could be usefull here is not puting a GS requirements but to just enforce some rules better and often cause really the problem is with low or high gs those people just leave dont participate in the rbg and become -1 to the group and since some of them who are low geared and even if they do participate they leave all the time before bg end or sitting far from battle so even after 3 months they still have same gear and still arent capable of assiting their group because of that.

#9 » Post by **Naljs** » 24 Dec 2015 01:47

This idea is so dumb I want to level up a horde warrior and queue in level 60 gear. Maybe even run on top of you when you try to Prowl around the alliance players. God, you guys...

#10 » Post by **Fastor** » 24 Dec 2015 01:47

http://www.tinyurl.com/startpvp

#11 » Post by **marisco** » 24 Dec 2015 10:22

benzviliran wrote: i agree with many things that you say, but you do agree that people who join rbgs with 1k hp many times probably do that to get gear?

now if you do agree with me about what i asked above than do you agree that if they join to also get gear they should also stay untill bg end in order to get bonus extra points losing/winning? do you also agree they wont be afk and try to participate in battles or for example use helpfull abillities that it doesnt matter if you have low gear u can still be usefull?

not long ago i created an ally druid, i joined with about 15k hp, when it was warsong i mostly used roots and cycloned pounce etc to cc and slow right targets, helped healers and such.

in AB i just went prowling/stealth and captured camps behind horde backs.

in AV i did the same with towers, in 1 single game (that by the way alliance won) i had 31 towers assaulted and thats with just 20k hp druid, just by doing so i also made over 4-10 horde busy defending just by doing so which allowed my team to advance and capture the front towers.

u do agree with me that if u want to join rbgs and enjoy and get gear you will more likely to participate in it for extra honor?

thats why i think that its not the GS here atleast not most of it and yeah many retards with shadowmournes who play like vengeance and whine about people gear while they play the same as the one they whine about but the solution that could be usefull here is not puting a GS requirements but to just enforce some rules better and often cause really the problem is with low or high gs those people just leave dont participate in the rbg and become -1 to the group and since some of them who are low geared and even if they do participate they leave all the time before bg end or sitting far from battle so even after 3 months they still have same gear and still arent capable of assiting their group because of that.

A low-gs ban would just jump to conclusion that every low geared player enters the BGs to afk, which is not true. I agree with your points about how a low-gs players CAN still be useful and SHOULD be useful yeah. Its makes the game more enjoyable to everyone and helps the honor grinding. But at what point are you still be willing to help a team that does nothing but shit talk you about your gear the moment you enter the BG? Hell, people actually whisper/send mail to others after the BG is over to tell them not to queue again. How far are you willing to go and give your best to play alongside this kind of people?

The big problem here is the circlejerk mentality of the pvp community. I'm all in for harder punishment for people that AFK during BGs. People should be reported in-game and if the issue is happening over and over again, a formal forum report should be made and the staff should punish the player as they see fit (maybe harder punishment is due?) But, again, let's not jump to the conclusion that every low-geared player is an AFKer and please, how about not making people AFK during bgs by being toxic to them?

Fastor wrote:http://www.tinyurl.com/startpvp

As much as I and probably everyone else appreciate the effort you made with that post, let's debate that the concept that having a player experience (or rather, grind) PVE content so that they can be prepared for PVP is just absurd? Farming 300+ EoT and hoping for VoA drops just to go to a BG and be "allowed" to play with the "pros" doesn't sound a little outlandish to you? Sure, if you have spare emblems that will always be a valid option, but what if the player is at that moment equiping his PVE main spec or off-spec, or maybe using the emblems for gems, or maybe using the emblems to buy looms? In that timeframe he should not queue for BGs because his priority isn't spending his emblems on pvp gear?

I find it funny, since on the old server I played it was the exact opposite: people would shit talking you for joining heroic dungeons in a mix of blues and greens and would recommend that you farm pvp to get furious gear, which would serve as a entry level pve gear in their opinion. I really don't know which one of the two concepts is more mind-boggling

#12 » Post by **Fastor** » 24 Dec 2015 10:56

You misunderstood usefulness of my guide.

Idea was to get PvP gear faster than he would get by just joining Battlegrounds. Sure he still can force his way into every BG to get gear, but if you check yourself that you get average 1500 honor per BG (if even that), you would need more than 100 Battlegrounds in order to finish Fury set. Now check that you will get Fury set with EoT by farming Dungeons for three days. Thus by doing farming EoT is in fact faster than farming Battlegrounds for basic PvP set.

You did mention options for what also player may do with EoT, but l dont think you saw anywhere in my guide saying that getting PvP gear is must. It is up to player to pick what will he do at start of lvl 80. l offered option for basic PvP gear set. Also on way farming EoT he will have option to get PvE items in dungeons.

Now about saying that l said player should get PvP gear in order to play BG, well l cant say lm happy to see 0 geared players entering BG but l already expressed my idea at very start of guide.

Have you ever wished to join battleground but you just hit 80 and have not any PvP gear or any good PVE?
Have you been farmed in battleground for that?
Have your team mates been yelled at you because of gear?
Well, they are somewhat right since you dying so easily and wasting spot for probably better player but tell them to "fuck off" if they dont point you to this guide.

Key is somewhat, if you lack both skill and gear, you will bring hard time on your teamplayers. All does change if you have some skill (eg Benz explanation), or at least some gear so you could take few more and deal few more punches thus giving some help to team.

However, let me quote part of my guide again

(Gear is not skill! Even if you proper follow this guide and collect best gear from it, you will still suck hard if you don’t know PVP basics of your class. For that feel free to ask any player in game for advices.)

If player does have gear but still suck, than not even idea of banning 0 gear players that OP was considering would give progress and thus we change question to: "Do we need players with full gear no skill"? Well that is question for other topic, but here we speak about those with no gear.

My conclusion (and reason why l made guide long ago), is that bringing people with NO Gear and NO Skill is big handicap. At those BGs it can be only be balanced again if opposite team also have similar players, which is rare.

Therefore, saying to all new lvl 80 player, if you want to play battlegrounds, you are welcomed but as long as you start getting gear and skill at normal speed with all methods possible. I already seen people getting full gear under one week. Not that you need whole week just to get stupid shoulders.

#13 » Post by **Doctor_J** » 24 Dec 2015 15:07

Naljs wrote:This idea is so dumb I want to level up a horde warrior and queue in level 60 gear. Maybe even run on top of you when you try to Prowl around the alliance players. God, you guys...

Some horde warrior did do exactly this (forgot name as not recent) but remember one time there was a load of tickets and players qq'ing about a warrior queueing for bg in level 70 gear when the player concerned was asked about this was said that its to make pvp more challenging as was too easy in 80 gear p: but still had full wrathful p:

#14 » Post by **Wilcox** » 24 Dec 2015 15:10

Doctor_J wrote:
Naljs wrote:This idea is so dumb I want to level up a horde warrior and queue in level 60 gear. Maybe even run on top of you when you try to Prowl around the alliance players. God, you guys...
Some horde warrior did do exactly this (forgot name as not recent) but remember one time there was a load of tickets and players qq'ing about a warrior queueing for bg in level 70 gear when the player concerned was asked about this was said that its to make pvp more challenging as was too easy in 80 gear p: but still had full wrathful p:

phlegma also does shit of that sort, plays with thunderfury and t9 for style, what a retard

#15 » Post by **Fastor** » 24 Dec 2015 15:36

Well, Thunderfury increase nature damage by 25%, which are poisons

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