[Rejected] Twinks in BGs

Velasong · #1 » Post by **Velasong** » 07 Apr 2014 15:06

For those of you thinking it,no this isn't a 'remove twinks' suggestion,more of a balancing bgs with twinks in them suggestion.
As it stands now,twinks are in the same queue as non-twinks,not exactly blizzlike but understandable here due to population.
So heres my idea...
Instead of the queues as they are now,players with XP turned off can not enter a BG unless there is another player with XP turned off queued for the opposite faction.To prevent further imbalance,the same limitation will apply for the next lot of twinks queued. Example being 1 horde twink queued,2 ally twinks queued.the horde twink and 1 ally twink can enter the BG.Later on another horde twink queues,both the horde twink and the ally twink are placed into the BG.If theres no horde twink queued and 1 ally twink queued,the ally twink won't be able to enter.
Getting farmed by twinks can be discouraging for new players,or players looking to learn PvP.This should hopefully prevent that,or reduce the likelyhood of it happening.it may have the benefit of more low level BGs,since less people would avoid queuing so they won't get farmed by twinks.
Twinking is apart of the game,and it shouldn't be removed,but since seperate queues aren't a viable option here,balancing the BGs with twinks in them is a more viable option.

Rehan · #2 » Post by **Rehan** » 07 Apr 2014 15:34

If making a separate queue for players who turned off their XP gain is impossible or too hard to make for our developers, what makes you think that they can make it so it detects twinks that queue up for BGs and places them equally on both teams?

#3 » Post by **Fastor** » 07 Apr 2014 16:02

+1 for Velasong.

#4 » Post by **Myaoming** » 07 Apr 2014 19:55

Rehan wrote:what makes you think that they can make it so it detects twinks that queue up for BGs and places them equally on both teams?

No worries it can be done.

#5 » Post by **Belthezar** » 07 Apr 2014 19:58

That's a genius idea. That way the twinks can stay in same bracket but it will be balanced. I don't care that much about twinks as long as it's balanced, I still get my fair share of what I want. It would kinda be like 80 bracket bgs, even tho at 80 everyone's a twink and few are undergeared (in comparison to leveller gear)
If it can be done, I vote for this.

#6 » Post by **Mojo** » 08 Apr 2014 20:14

I don't think that's a good idea because bg at low lvl are rare and so twinks will be have to wait much longer than before

#7 » Post by **Doctor_J** » 08 Apr 2014 20:19

Ye but also twinks are the main reason why a lot of people dont bother queueing for battlegrounds until level 80 as people dont like queuing to get farmed by twinks

#8 » Post by **Arvit** » 08 Apr 2014 21:41

+1, doubt the staff can do this though.

#9 » Post by **shaun03** » 08 Apr 2014 22:58

This surely can only be attributed to the 10-19 battleground? If you remove the number of twinks from the higher level of brackets, with perhaps barring the ally side for 60-69, there will be no battlegrounds going on at all.

I don't see the point in destroying the pvp population any further than what it is already. For example, on my level 60-69 priest (which I am planning to twink btw), I wish for Aymaneknight (horde 69 dk twink - possibly the most OP twink in the bracket) to join if it means I can get into the battleground. I may lose, and my partners may leave, but I persist, not out of stubbornness, but because I want to find his weaknesses, even if it means dying over and over again. If you do implement something like this, I would like to see GM's take a more active stance in promoting battlegrounds at lower levels, although I highly doubt that that would happen, because lower level pvp is never a real priority.

You may take this from an active "twinker's" point of view.

I know how it feels to wait for players to join the higher level queues. Especially the horde. If you implement your idea Vela, we'll be waiting ages longer for entrance to a battleground. Twinks are a part of the server, and rather than trying to focus on getting them removed from the equation(because even though you say its more to balance the server pvp population, you and I both know its going to have the "removal" effect), you should rather try to stimulate pvp by getting more people to join.

There is little 1 twink can do against 10 other levels, all focusing on him at one time. Twinks aren't immortal.

And anyways, how can this not apply to level 80 battlegrounds then? So many times I have gotten into WSG 80 with a team of badly geared allies, going up against players like Sickbrain, Nix, Mosthated, Deltron etc, that I've altogether decided not to play at level 80 anymore. The horde are like a powerhouse at 80 and literally only have to decide when they want to "complete the objectives" of the battleground to win it. I can't blame this on the badly geared alliance members, they're just trying to gear up... I did the same when I was a reasonably fresh 80.

If it is decided that people want to balance bgs at lower levels, then I propose the same to be done at level 80.

#10 » Post by **Stormhand** » 08 Apr 2014 23:03

Good idea, sadly I am afraid it will not change things for the better.

For instance today: for the 1st time I play here I saw 6 alliance twinks vs 7 horde twinks in a 10-19 BG, after horde were killed around 2 times, 5 left...so its not an issue of gear so much as it is of way of thinking imo.

Point is some people will leave and wont re-que after killed a few times, twink or not.

(shaun you will be happy to know Aymane died to a 65 lock)

Velasong · #11 » Post by **Velasong** » 09 Apr 2014 02:38

Well yes,there is the possibility that this could result in longer queues,just like it has the chance to result in quicker queues.Less imbalance and less chance of getting farmed by twinks will be more appealing to new players or players in general wanting to PvP and level up.But yes it does mean less twinks getting in,but it can also encourage people to have a twink in both factions,which may balance things out,still the same number of twinks playing,just less imbalance.I agree that the staff could promote BG's more,especially at lower levels,but with the increased XP not being enough to encourage people,maybe another idea would work,something that wouldn't cause problems at some point( a gold reward based on a win or loss might be good or bad,but also unlikely to happen anyway)
It doesn't help that people leave after dieing once or twice,but what can we do to prevent that?increased time on deserter buff?might not go over too well,and it might not even be effective.

#12 » Post by **Ragnorak** » 09 Apr 2014 08:58

Velasong wrote:Well yes,there is the possibility that this could result in longer queues,just like it has the chance to result in quicker queues.

Give me whatever the hell you are smoking if you somehow believe in any way that this will result in quicker queues for twinks...

Anyways this has been mentioned before and steps were taken because of this same issue. Back in 2012 a suggestion to deal with the issue of twinking was made by Ashiel. Since the devs weren't able to script it in a way so that players who turn off their XP would be placed in a separate BG queue, Roel decided to implement "Stat Scaling" which was the most unblizzlike feature this server has every tried to implement, it was flawed to say the least.
In my opinion if the devs can script it then great, do it. But it should only be implemented for the 10-19 bracket since there arent enough twinks in the other brackets to make a huge difference.

Velasong · #13 » Post by **Velasong** » 09 Apr 2014 09:12

i was thinking more along the lines of more players in general end up queuing as a possibility,not just twinks.players can have characters on both factions so worse case,people don't log their twinks/alts of opposite faction and less bgs happen,best case people jump around on alts/twinks and hopefully it results in more bgs,and more non-twinks staying in/actually queuing.i didn't want to go down the 'stat scaling' path as that worked out kinda badly,level 12's killing twinks seemed a bit too much,an i didn't want to just remove twinks completely.
if it gets accepted and it fails,which lets be honest is possible,then it'll no doubt be removed.I'm simply trying to make PvP more fun at lower levels for people leveling,instead of getting camped and frustrated by 2+ twinks and all they have is another lowbie to back them up,or no one if the other person leaves,or people when larger BG's occur.
Also,the 10-19 bracket might be best,considering twinking at say 69 takes longer and not alot would want to level 2 characters to 69.It might be a good bracket to test it out aswell,see if it fails or not.

#14 » Post by **Belthezar** » 09 Apr 2014 15:11

I don't think you people understood how this helps pvp, twinks often, almost always, unbalance the game, but this isn't a slight balance, most of the time a twink can solo 3 or more wiht facility. I've come across hundreds of levellers that wouldn't join bgs because of twinks being present. And I don't see the problem with having some fairness involved, twink vs twink, cuz unless you're a real shitty twink (there are those as well) nobody that isn't a twink will be able to kill you, and below level 60, 70, 80 bgs will mostly consist of 2v2-5v5 at most, so 1 twink makes a huge difference.

I can't see how this would in any way hinder pvp, not having a twink in bg never annoyed anyone. Twinks are fun on the team if it's balanced, at 10-19 when ally twinks joined and horde twinks weren't present, the game was ruined for ally levellers in that bracket as well because all horde naturally left, as any sane person would, since it's quite obviously pointless just sit and get farmed. However when games where both sides have equal amount of twinks occur, everyone has fun, as far as I know, I know I did yesterday when it was 7v7 in 10-19 with 6v6 being twinks, it kinda felt like level 80 bgs, with healers and stuff.
So yeah if it's possible, I can only see twinks who like it easy being hurt by this.

#15 » Post by **shaun03** » 09 Apr 2014 15:13

I will only whole-heartedley support your idea if the same were to be done at level 80. If the battleground queues for twinks do end up becoming longer, I don't see much point in myself playing here anymore.

I have played on 3 different servers - not as a twink in any bracket - (all with similar populations), and Truewow is the only server that has a decent sum of low level battlegrounds going on throughout the day. Its the reason I have come back here, from trying out the other servers.

The only reason I have twinks is because I wanted to balance out the specific brackets I have twinks in, because at one stage, the horde were running around, killing for fun(on twinks), in all of them.

One last thing, as I have stated before, if you could do this at low levels, I think it would be beneficial to have the same kind of thing instituted at level 80. Vela's same reasoning for the lower levels joining more if there were less twinks can be said for level 80 players too, I know a lot of players (alliance members) would join battlegrounds a lot more if there weren't fully geared horde up against them. Push them into their own battleground, you have the level 80 population to do that.

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