First time Warrior

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Chenerez
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First time Warrior

#1 » Post by Chenerez » 28 Feb 2014 01:40

Hey guys
I'm new to warrior class and i could use some help with building my char like talent build and etc.
I'm looking for making a fair PVE/PVP char.
A bit info about what Fury and Arms means will be great also lol

Thanks in advance.

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Re: First time Warrior

#2 » Post by ???? » 28 Feb 2014 02:16

http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... x0s:msazMm
Classic Arms PvP Spec.
Because of the huge Rage feed, Improved Heroic Strike wouldn't be much of an impactful change, and a Warrior isn't a Warrior without some dynamic action - Parry.
An Arms Warrior also specializes into long-term battles if possible, which is why Improved Rend and Deep Wounds are there - for added damage to bring your enemies down faster and harder, as well as weaken them in case you're being kited seemingly endlessly.
Iron Will is a great Talent against Stuns and Charms considering a ton of Classes have Stuns, and those autocast-'til-DR Seduction spams are always a nuisance.
Tactical Mastery is one of the most important Talents for any Warrior, especially in PvP - it allows great flexibility, and introduces the so-called "Stance Dance" - constant switching inbetween Stances during action-packed fights to correspond to the needs right on the go.
Overpower is one of your main abilities - it is useable as soon as you get dodged (parried too with Glyph of Overpower), and it also applies the Unrelenting Assault debuff which is a big turn-the-tables Talent for when fighting casters. Getting the Improved Overpower Talent is crucial as it will ensure the crit hit and thus the proc of Wrecking Crew, Deep Wounds, Blood Frenzy, Trauma, and so on.
Sweeping Strikes is basically five Cleaves at about a third of the cost needed for five actual real Cleaves - it's a nice handy tool, considering it can also be used in sync with other attacks, such as Whirlwind (Bladestorm) and Cleave itself to use multiple SS procs at once for some massive AoE.
Here's the tricky bit - Weapon Specialization Talents. Poleaxe allows you to get up to 5% more Melee Crit Chance and gives your crit hits up to 5% boost to their DMG while wielding a polearm or an axe. Mace allows you to get up to 15% Armor Penetration while wielding a mace - passively. Sword allows you to get up to a 10% chance of striking a selected target with your sword for the same damage as a normal swing of your sword would be. So, choose what you'd prefer here.
Trauma for more Rend and Deep Wounds damage as well as group support since it's target-bound, and Weapon Mastery to eliminate the need of anti-Disarm enchants as well as minimalize the chances of getting dodged.
Second Wind and Blood Craze are your main on-proc Heal over Time effects - they're crucial as one procs whenever you are Stunned and/or Immobilized, and the other procs whenever you get critically hit. Both work nicely with Strength of Arms taken as well, considering that also works sorta like Weapon Mastery due to its Expertise boost.
Juggernaut is yet another pearl an Arms Warrior possesses - Charge becomes usable in combat and gives Mortal Strike/Slam a 25% increased chance to crit after Charging, but the ability itself gets a 5 second increase on its CD - fair price.
Unrelenting Assault, as already mentioned, is crucial for when fighting casters, because you can apply a debuff which halves magical healing taken and damage done if Overpower gets successfully used during the enemy victim's cast. It also lowers the CD of both OP and Revenge to 1 sec., which is basically your GCD - allowing you to spam both, giving some stylistic and tactical diversity and freedom.
Sudden Death is an extra addition which is very nice - it allows the use of Execute even when your enemy isn't at or below 20% HP, and you keep 10 Rage after using Execute no matter what, allowing the re-application of Rend, Hamstring, using up 2 Overpowers, using Bash, etc., and considering Execute is a very powerful although costly ability (cost can be lowered using Glyph of Execution), it's a very handy and practical Talent for extra damage and overall DPS.
Armored to the Teeth is great for gaining extra AP - don't have to wear the most Armor just because of that though. It's simply extra AP.
Booming Voice is a nice group-support and tactical Talent - increases the range and duration of all three mentioned Shouts and because of that, your Demoralizing Shout becomes better at revealing stealthed targets.
Piercing Howl - AoE Snare, can be used to reveal stealthed targets too. Simple as that.
A clarification on the choice of Glyph of Thunder Clap - as a Warrior, you'll always get kited a lot and be in pickles where you'll be just out of reach - especially on this server due to bugs. This little handy Glyph allows you to narrow that reach and allow you to land the hit right before it's too late - it can be a life-saver.

Here's also an Arms PvE Spec - yeah Arms PvE in WotLK isn't that known but it actually is viable, although it's harder than even Feral DPS, so, you've been warned.
http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... Z0h:IMmzMm
Similar to the PvP Spec except most PvP elements are taken out and replaced with more PvE-viable elements.
Sword Spec still since its extra hits, being practically extra melee hits, generate you more Rage and let you be less stressed and give you some more freedom.
Weapon Mastery for anti-Dodge.
Booming Voice or Unbridled Wrath 2/5 - in the first case you have a slightly longer-lasting and longer-range Shout so you don't have to waste as much Rage and not run right into the middle of a crowd to buff everyone up, and in the second case you have some slight additional Rage feed - pick what you'd prefer as well.
Piercing Howl is still a great Talent even outside of PvP - great CC on mobs, even on the Val'kyr during the Lich King encounter in ICC.
Improved Thunder Clap for more AoE DMG and DPS as well as more group support via improved hindering effects on mobs.
This particular build is more AoE-based which is why Glyph of Cleaving and Glyph of Bladestorm are there, as well as, still, Glyph of Thunder Clap. Arms Warriors are good enough at laying down some DMG and overall DPS, but they don't offer much in terms of AoE since unlike Fury Warriors they can't use Whirlwind all the time, much less on a shorter CD with more DMG and all that, and Thunder Clap hits nowhere as near as it does, although it has no limit to enemy count - even increasing the number of targets your Cleave alone hits by one can be a big change in a lot of situations, considering a big portion of them have AoE.

For gearing, as Arms and as Fury, you need ArP. ArP is your main Stat since every single bit of damage you do is 100% Physical, meaning Armor reduces that damage - getting ArP acts as a counter to Armor, ensuring you will do a ton of damage. Secondary Stats are Strength and Agility - Strength for more Attack Power and thus your overall damage gets a boost, especially Rend, Deep Wounds, Revenge, Execute, Heroic Throw, Shattering Throw, Thunder Clap and Victory Rush. Agility if you want more Crit for those big jumping numbers everyone always likes, unless you're the enemy of course.

TL;DR: Arms is more about utilizing stuff and giving yourself freedom as well as being more tactical, while Fury is more about direct brute force without giving two cents if you're gonna die or not.
Arms is more of an all-around Spec while Fury is just plain DPS. Doesn't mean they can't compete, though.

The big pile of text up there is there because I want to show you how exciting and diverse Arms is - you can use your own imagination and be anything you want - you can even dual wield as Arms in an actual legit Dual Wield Spec.

Hope this helps.

Later.
Alexander "Keosu" Will -- The Half-hearted Hero
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Darchrow
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Re: First time Warrior

#3 » Post by Darchrow » 28 Feb 2014 02:25

and here i was writing a post trying to help the lad, and as i clicked submit, you had already done it, and 10x better than what i had done xD
???? covered it all, and i do mean all, so have fun playing warr :D
( go arms, pve and pvp )
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Vaen
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Re: First time Warrior

#4 » Post by Vaen » 28 Feb 2014 02:56

I wanted to say that my personal glyph preference (and what most warriors go with) is Glyph of MS, Hamstring and either Sweeping or Rending, that RNG snare is just too useful at times. For minor glyphs I use battle instead of thunder clap.
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Relina
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Re: First time Warrior

#5 » Post by Relina » 28 Feb 2014 05:31

PvP Arms is more robust than PvP Fury which is a damned glass cannon, its fun though to flail around with 2 massive 2hand weapons :D as PvP Fury, especially in bg's

But a well played Fury warrior will always out damage a well played Arms warrior at-least in mid to end game PvE, its not the players / specs fault but just how badly blizzard failed with making arms scale for PvE in WOTLK.

Since Arms PvE was covered by ????'s post, I'll just give you a link to the bible of WOTLK Fury PvE : >>>Warrior: Fury Compendium - Elitist Jerks<<<
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Chenerez
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Re: First time Warrior

#6 » Post by Chenerez » 28 Feb 2014 12:43

Wow thanks alot guys!
did expected that amount of help ^_^
one more question if i may, whats you recommendation about strong bunker-tank warrior (mostly for PvE speaking)?

Thanks again you helpful guys :D

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Re: First time Warrior

#7 » Post by ???? » 28 Feb 2014 13:44

For "bunker-tanking" there's Prot, and if you really wanna go deep, you can do that. For instance, this Spec:
http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... sGo:NdrzMm
Shield Specialization, Deflection, and Anticipation all at 5/5 for max Avoidance and Rage feed, although if you want Improved Thunder Clap (provided no other Prot Warrior with that is nearby or an Arms Warrior for that matter), you can take three points from Anticipation and put them in that Talent.
Full Toughness and Armored to the Teeth for max Attack Power gain - the more Armor, the more hits you can take, and at the same time, the harder you hit.
Full Improved Spell Reflection so that you can gain some "Avoidance" in terms of evading spells, as well as being able to reflect any next spell cast at anyone other than you - a real lifesaver.
No Puncture or Focused Rage because as a tank you'll be taking hits and avoiding hits the whole time, generating so much Rage that you should be capped at 100 constantly.
Vigilance is important for key group members - such as another tank, or a valued healer or even DPS - as it reduces their damage taken, transfers a portion of the Threat they generate over to you, and as they take damage, your Taunt's CD gets reseted allowing you to quickly take over any situation with ease and efficiency.
Safeguard is a failsafe Talent - if anyone is in trouble or is about to be, Intervene that particular target and the damage they take for a while will literally almost be reduced by a whole third.
Improved Demoralizing Shout for further control over mobs by reducing their damage on you - neither Arms nor Fury really take this Talent so it'd be a nice addition for a Prot to do that, considering Prots are all about handling Aggro, taking hits, avoiding hits, supporting the group and saving the group. It's the same as Improved Thunder Clap, pretty much.
Commanding Presence for major group support via improved Shouts - Battle Shout wouldn't really be needed despite its benefit since there are Paladins with Improved Blessing of Might, so the key here is actually Commanding Shout - more HP. Some Fury Warriors (also top-geared ones) may have this Talent too (rarely Arms Warriors), so you could drop that and check out the other Talents you may want to consider getting in such a case - Incite, Cruelty, etc..
Glyph of Shockwave for max uptime on your AoE DMG and CC.
Glyph of Blocking to be able to stop more DMG as you block as well as do more DMG yourself.
Glyph of Last Stand for a better frequency of emergency survival by reducing the ability's CD to let you be more flexible when it comes to hot situations, although that might not be always needed, so you could consider taking Glyph of Taunt instead - to be more sure that it will land its hit - or some other Glyph you may like.
Minor Glyphs are the same (yeah they're my personal favorites for whatever purpose in whatever Spec) - Bloodrage for no HP gimp when you use it, Charge for longer-range Charges that might actually just save the day when otherwise you could be just out of reach, and Thunder Clap for more radius and thus more AoE.

In terms of Prot PvP you can try:
http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... sGo:dcNzMm
which is more based on being a solo-type of guy (no Safeguard, no Vigilance, points used for more offensive abilities), or:
http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... sGo:dcNzMm
if you want to be more group-involved and go with a healer, reason why self-defense Talents are missing and more offensive Talents such as Impale are there, as well as group-support ones such as Safeguard and Vigilance yet again, so you can be more of a deathmachine.

For PvE gearing as Prot, you need to be Hit-capped and Expertise-capped in order to make as many hits as possible count, to ensure you'll keep on building Threat and keeping it as it is - in your possession. Also Defense - your main defensive tanking Stat - to reduce the chances of getting Hit and so on. Of course, Armor as well, to mitigate as much Physical damage as possible.

For PvP gearing you need ArP to max out your Physical damage done, and STR off-sets since some certain abilities are also heavily-AP-based, such as Revenge, Shockwave, and so on. Although if you wanna be annoying you can go full-PvP and tank whole groups of people using the solo-type Spec.

I agree with Vaen's post as his is also a personal opinion and a good one at that - as much as Improved Hamstring (and/or Glyph of Hamstring) can be removed in many ways, most often that luck-based proc gives you that momentary turn-the-tables effect which can be very crucial in winning in PvP, as well as his choice of Sweeping Strikes for no-cost SS to help with multitasking or Rending for the longer fights in which those several extra Rend ticks may mean the difference.

Fury is still Fury as it's already been said - it's powerful but also fragile. It's not as versatile as Arms, though it has its own numerous, practical and fun ways to go around that - getting Glyph of Bloodthirst and Enraged Regeneration for a lot more healing, gearing into some heavy PvP items with PvP gems and enchants to cushion everything and make fights longer as well as annoying for the enemies (nobody likes when they can't kill a Fury Warrior with ease or fast for that matter), and many other methods.

Fury's gearing is basically stacking ArP and focusing more on STR for raw power rather than Agility for more Crit since you already have more Crit as opposed to other Specs, considering you also have Improved Berserker Stance in which you stay almost the whole time.

About Arms VS Fury - yes Fury is meant to be a pure-DPS Spec while Arms is meant to be more of a group-support/survival/utility Spec, although both can still heavily compete with each other. Fury is simple but effective, so even in the hands of an inexperienced player with no idea how to gear, it can still wreck, but if you do the same but as an Arms Warrior, the result will be far different - it's much more difficult and complex, and as said, it wasn't made to be better or as good nor as simple as Fury at all - it's a completely different style, with its own advantages and disadvantages, perks and miss-outs, and so on.
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Chenerez
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Re: First time Warrior

#8 » Post by Chenerez » 28 Feb 2014 17:53

wow man ur amazing! thanks a lot! ^_^

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