Demonology Lock question

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Myaoming
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#16 » Post by Myaoming » 18 Jan 2014 12:29

hugeegosorry wrote:at end game gear on blizz ive heard that affli lock is the best bet, but here i hear demonology (even withouth felguard but with imp)
Affliction does outDPS both Demonology and the Hybrid spec here as well, like Relina said.

For a Full Demonology build, I suggest this:

Image

Why 2x Aftermath? Since I noticed Immolate (DoT) is 3rd place on my recount after Shadowbolt and Soulfire. I decided to boost it even more. I picked this talent and Glyph of Immolate. It critting up to 7k with my current gear (that sucky gear xD)

Why 2x Nemesis not 3x? Well, not enough points :P But I haven't encountered issues like this. It can just have a direct impact on DBS encounter, but it's also raid dependent (if the raid's DPS is OP or not) whether you find the time to pop 2x Metamorphosis or just one.
Usually on Marrow 25HC you can pop 2, Lady 25HC 2-3, Rot/Fester 25hc 2, PP 25hc 3-4, BPC 25hc 1-2, BQL25hc 2-3, Sindy 25hc 2-3, despite if it's 2x or 3x on Nemesis according to my experience.
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#17 » Post by hugeegosorry » 18 Jan 2014 16:52

Myaoming wrote:
interesting oppinion but i hear here imp > felguard all the way. do u know something that others dont? :p

also, if you are playing felguard, why improved imp?
get demonic embrace; your stamina = pet stamina = spellpower.
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#18 » Post by Dalve » 18 Jan 2014 19:36

I have read some discussion here and there are many things you will have to consider when playing demo warlock, especially what kind of gear you got and what kind of classes and speccs that are a part of your raid or party.

http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... AoE00V:qb0

Above would be the optimal (with imp) where you have high end gear.
If you are NOT hitcapped you have to take points in Suppresion. Remove points in Ruin or Improved Shadowbolt. See what gives you the least dps decrease.
You can also try to use Demonic Power if your imp does a massive amount of damage.

Rotation:
(cast shadowbolt when tank is going in) - CoE (if similar buff exists in raid or group, use Curse of Doom/Agony, see what works for you) - Immolate - Corruption - Metamorphosis - Shadowbolt - Incinerate (Molten Core) - Soulfire (when below 35%)

Spell Prio:
Keep dots up at all times and try not to overlap them so you decrease your DPS and lose out on extra dot ticks.
Soulfire (below 35%) > Incinerate (molten core) > Shadowbolt
Try to use your Metamorphosis with cooldowns (it is worth waiting perhaps 10 second so that you use Metamorphosis with trinkets). Additionally, time your Metamorphosis with bloodboil to maximize damage.

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Re: Demonology Lock question

#19 » Post by hugeegosorry » 18 Jan 2014 20:09

hmm but can i go into icc without intensity talent? i mean off the top of my head i can think of encounters that would require taht talent - fester rot bq pp

also, isnt metamorphosis glyph a must have? :)
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#20 » Post by Relina » 18 Jan 2014 23:10

Glyph of Meta is not as big a dps gain as it seems on 1st glance, though atm there is a bug which boosts it value slightly.
This table shows the relative values of different glyphs for the differing demo spec's, ofc this was constructed using data from retail servers so might not apply exactly to TW.
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#21 » Post by Dalve » 19 Jan 2014 14:51

http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... oEo0Vb:q0b

something similar to this then? I feel the biggest problem with demo in wotlk is that you always have to sacrifice something important whereever you go in the talent tree so it is all about what your prioritations are. Perhaps if you're really dedicated you can have 2 demo speccs haha.

The Metamorphosis glyph is ok but incinerate, imp and immolate glyphs will increase your dps more than metamorphosis.

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Re: Demonology Lock question

#22 » Post by emsy » 19 Jan 2014 15:11

Dalve wrote:http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... oEo0Vb:q0b

something similar to this then? I feel the biggest problem with demo in wotlk is that you always have to sacrifice something important whereever you go in the talent tree so it is all about what your prioritations are. Perhaps if you're really dedicated you can have 2 demo speccs haha.

The Metamorphosis glyph is ok but incinerate, imp and immolate glyphs will increase your dps more than metamorphosis.
Why would u choose 4% imp crit instead of -0.5s firebolt cast time? Isn't this better http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... oEoMVb:q0b ?

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Re: Demonology Lock question

#23 » Post by Myaoming » 19 Jan 2014 15:17

hugeegosorry wrote:interesting oppinion but i hear here imp > felguard all the way. do u know something that others dont? :p
Imp > Felguard? Warlocks should think about themselves before thinking about their minions. Even if Imp does more damage, main reason why you should use Felguard most of the time is:

Image

5% extra damage to both Fire and Shadow, unlike the Imp, that boosts Fire only.



hugeegosorry wrote:also, if you are playing felguard, why improved imp?
Myaoming wrote:as Demonology, start off with Felguard, and switch to Imp at 35%.
I thought of that while picking the talent.



hugeegosorry wrote:get demonic embrace; your stamina = pet stamina = spellpower.
Stat scaling is currently bugged, so I don't trust it much. But still, I think you're right with replacing Improved Imp or Demonic Brutality with Demonic Embrace. It's also a + to the Survivability.
With working minions, the whole build changes anyway.



hugeegosorry wrote:isnt metamorphosis glyph a must have?
A list of Glyphs a Demonology would think of:
- Corruption: pretty useless without Glyph of Quick Decay. Corruption ticks every 3 seconds, and each tick has a 4% to proc this Glyph for you, and if you're unlucky like me, then what's the point of wasting a Glyph slot for this?

- Glyph of Felguard: This was supposed to be a must with a working Felguard. Since Felguards are bugged like most minions, no need to get that. And Relina even said it's bugged, but I can't confirm that.

- Glyph of Immolate:
Myaoming wrote:I noticed Immolate (DoT) is 3rd place on my recount after Shadowbolt and Soulfire. I decided to boost it even more. I picked this talent and Glyph of Immolate. It critting up to 7k with my current gear.
- Glyph of Incinerate: I'm not a fan of Incinerate myself, why? You only use it when Molten Core procs, and it doesn't proc much I must say (depends on luck again).
Shadowbolt still does more than Incinerate even with Molten Core + Glyph.
Reason why you use Incinerate on Molten Core is because of the cast speed you get. But let's say you're on Bloodlust/Heroism, Shadowbolt will be cast in 1.1-1.2, and Incinerate around 0.7-0.8, which is below 1 second (GCD). The Haste from Molten Core is gone to waste then, therefore you end up sticking to Shadowbolt spam in such case. And below 35% you completely ditch both and spam Soulfire. So in a 5 mins fight, you will probably use 12 Incinerates max. Not worth boosting I'd say :)

- Glyph of Life Tap: A must. A quick and easy gain of ~100 SP without focusing on Spirit gear (you shouldn't focus on that anyway)

- Glyph of Metamorphosis: That Glyph lets you use 2x Immolation Aura, and gives you 6 additional seconds, which is 1/5 of Meta's initial duration, to enjoy an additional 20% damage boost on your Soulfire. I use it.

- Glyph of Quick Decay: What this Glyph does, is reducing the time between Corruption ticks according to your haste. Sounds good. Not really... You're actually boosting a Corruption that does what? 2-3k/tick? For a higher chance to proc Molten Core and Glyph of Corruption in case you have it. What about the GCDs you waste to reapply Corruption? Faster Corruption requires additional reapplications of it, resulting in less Shadowbolts cast.

So in the end, I suggest Glyph of Life Tap, Glyph of Immolate, and Glyph of Metamorphosis.
Elder Myaoming (aka Slardar): Level 80 Tauren Feral PvE/PvP
Siforosse of the Undercity: Level 80 Undead Affliction Warlock PvP/Demon PvE
Zibuluge of the Ashen Verdict: Level 80 Human Frost DK PvP/PvE
Inverse: Level 80 Human Fire Mage PvP/PvE
Slar: Level 80 Night Elf Resto/Feral Druid PvE

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Re: Demonology Lock question

#24 » Post by hugeegosorry » 19 Jan 2014 16:51

Myaoming wrote:

wow, well thats a lot to think about :D

so then what would be your suggestion of a build?

shouldnt this build work best?

keep in mind im only looking for MAX dps output pve :D lets not lose track of that :p
Last edited by hugeegosorry on 19 Jan 2014 17:21, edited 1 time in total.
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Relina
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#25 » Post by Relina » 19 Jan 2014 17:21

its nice to see a full on discussion on the ups & downs of the demo spec on TW :)
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#26 » Post by Fastor » 19 Jan 2014 17:23

I still dont get what is going on here. :\

Damn evil mages with pets.

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hugeegosorry
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Re: Demonology Lock question

#27 » Post by hugeegosorry » 19 Jan 2014 17:24

Relina wrote:its nice to see a full on discussion on the ups & downs of the demo spec on TW :)
hugeegosorry wrote:
shouldnt this build work best?

keep in mind im only looking for MAX dps output pve :D lets not lose track of that :p
its only the conjuncture that brought me here :D else i would have been spamming affli topics, i guess...
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