LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

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Xeye

LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#1 » Post by Xeye » 20 Feb 2016 15:15

Yo, so I'm running into issues while trying to sort my shit out. Dunno what I'm doing wrong. http://www.truewow.org/armory/character ... liophilous This is my armory. Take a gander, tell what's missing (besides the stupid enchants, was leveling Enchanting).

I'm keeping my shields up all the time, using the standard 696 rotation. Can't seem to hold aggro very well contrary to what others say about paladins. Main problems are people with 5.5k+ gayscore and dps hungry whores. They get aggro fast, I'm not getting hit => no mana return, healer is not healing => even more mana starved, SoW ain't returning that much. I'm affraid to even attempt tanking a raid environment. Help plox!

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Nyeriah

Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#2 » Post by Nyeriah » 20 Feb 2016 15:58

These issues are quite natural for your gear. It's known that there were a couple of issues that gave paladins a huge TPS in the past but since they're gone things are quite normal now. I don't believe you're doing anything wrong.

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Justicelight
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#3 » Post by Justicelight » 20 Feb 2016 17:03

1. Try to use this spec: http://www.truewow.org/talent-calculato ... xf0xoc:NGp .
2. Keep Blessing of the Sanctuary all the time on you (gives you mana every time you avoid a hit).
3. Don't forget to use Divine Plea, and have it all the time refreshed during fight.
4. When you improve gear, try to avoid gemming parry, try to gem like this: blue - 30 stamina, red - 10 dodge 15 stamina, yellow - 10 def rating 15 stamina.
5. Enchant "mongoose" on your weapon.
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Fastor
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#4 » Post by Fastor » 20 Feb 2016 17:14

Avoid Justice of the Just talent and all Mages gonna hate you.

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Hansrutger
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#5 » Post by Hansrutger » 20 Feb 2016 17:32

Can't seem to hold aggro very well contrary to what others say about paladins.
This is like Nyeriah said a bit. People say paladins can hold aggro well due to the fact that most are geared. Also when you enter a random heroic, expect most players being higher geared than you so it is fully normal. However I'd go, in the start, a bit like Justice suggested with the spec, however I'd put some talents differently because I know how I have my own playstyle when being lower geared as prot tank. Otherwise the spec he suggested is very good for holding aggro. Basically from start just try to focus on getting your 540 defense rating (535 for rhc) and then just get shit that can improve your DPS. Most healers are good so they will be able to keep you up. Many wipes in RHC are actually caused by overaggro and therefore DPSers being critted by NPC's and healers then cannot keep up, very few NPC's in RHC's have actual heavy aoe spells. Anyways enough about healers. :D

Your hit rating is a bit of an issue as well, if you cannot hit the targets properly then you will lose aggro right there. Furthermore this is optional but I find Glyph of Defense really helpful. People can say what they want but I used to miss my taunts a lot so I got the glyph to fix it, as paladin taunts are considered actual spells so they need more hit rating to hit (mostly this is not an issue but I rather not take my chances when being OT at LK grabbing all those adds :D).

TL;DR: Get enough hit rating, get enough defense, go with the spec that gives you most aggro (Justicenib suggested good one) and build good aggro.

About mana issues, I try to avoid switching to SoW as much as I can because I know that I will lose lots of aggro due to not keeping put SoV. Remember that your HotR also puts SoV stacks on all targets that you hit it with.

Also we're in the same guild so if you need any help with anything feel free to poke me at anytime (do "/who master" or "/who pala" and you will most likely find me). :D
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#6 » Post by benzviliran » 20 Feb 2016 17:43

Xeye wrote:Yo, so I'm running into issues while trying to sort my shit out. Dunno what I'm doing wrong. http://www.truewow.org/armory/character ... liophilous This is my armory. Take a gander, tell what's missing (besides the stupid enchants, was leveling Enchanting).

I'm keeping my shields up all the time, using the standard 696 rotation. Can't seem to hold aggro very well contrary to what others say about paladins. Main problems are people with 5.5k+ gayscore and dps hungry whores. They get aggro fast, I'm not getting hit => no mana return, healer is not healing => even more mana starved, SoW ain't returning that much. I'm affraid to even attempt tanking a raid environment. Help plox!

Hi, let me make it simple for you, thats the best pala tank in the server(and not because of his gear):

http://www.truewow.org/armory/character.php?n=Belendor

just copy him and you will be alright, note he has belendortwo belendorthree and more aswell that you can check in the armory, he changes gear depending on bosses too(some items are better for specific bosses).

good luck have fun !
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#7 » Post by Hansrutger » 20 Feb 2016 18:05

benzviliran wrote:
Xeye wrote:Yo, so I'm running into issues while trying to sort my shit out. Dunno what I'm doing wrong. http://www.truewow.org/armory/character ... liophilous This is my armory. Take a gander, tell what's missing (besides the stupid enchants, was leveling Enchanting).

I'm keeping my shields up all the time, using the standard 696 rotation. Can't seem to hold aggro very well contrary to what others say about paladins. Main problems are people with 5.5k+ gayscore and dps hungry whores. They get aggro fast, I'm not getting hit => no mana return, healer is not healing => even more mana starved, SoW ain't returning that much. I'm affraid to even attempt tanking a raid environment. Help plox!

Hi, let me make it simple for you, thats the best pala tank in the server(and not because of his gear):

http://www.truewow.org/armory/character.php?n=Belendor

just copy him and you will be alright, note he has belendortwo belendorthree and more aswell that you can check in the armory, he changes gear depending on bosses too(some items are better for specific bosses).

good luck have fun !
Very incorrect about just copying. Never copy someone's spec when it comes to utility classes (tanks and healers), it's probably the worst thing you can do. My own spec is for instance for Val'kyr stuns, hence why I have 1/2 improved stun so I can always stun the valkyrs everytime they come. Belendor is indeed one of the best, if not the best tank on horde side (have only seen him heal on ally D: ) but copying his spec for RHC is not recommended as he has made his specs according to what his guild needs most for a tank to do in raids his guild does - if that made any sense. :/
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I'd say that trying is the best one can do in order to higher themselves from the people crying and only complaining. Whilst you try, it doesn't mean it is always going to be the most successful result but I'd like to think that it is still a better choice than standing idle.

TrueWoW main: Palamaster

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mcheka
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#8 » Post by mcheka » 20 Feb 2016 18:56

This won't exactly work for RHCs, but here is a good way to get initial aggro on a boss. When you're ~20-30 yards from the boss:

1. Sacred Shield yourself
2. Divine Plea
3. Put down a Consecration where you are.
4. Holy Shield.
5. Cast Exorcism to pull the boss, and hit Avenger's Shield right when the Exorcism cast ends (so you end up casting both at the same time).
6. Spam Judgement while the boss is coming to you but has not reached you.
7. Pop Avenging Wrath (wings) and at the same instant, start your 696969 rotation. At your gear level, always start with Shield of Righteousness, NOT Hammer of the Righteous. ShR will generate more threat.


Some other comments:

I would modify Justice's advice in the following way with respect to gemming:

Red socket: stamina/agility or stamina/expertise or even stamina/strength, NOT stamina/dodge. Why agility? Because agility gives a huge dodge contribution for paladins, as well as armor. In fact, if you total the mitigation from 1 agility (armor/dodge together), 1 point of agility will give you 97% of the average damage reduction as 1 point of dodge. However, it gives part of this as armor, which is a more useful stat than dodge (unless you like to scare your healers by taking 0 damage for awhile then having big damage spikes, instead of predictable constant damage throughout the fight). In addition, agility will also give you some crit to help you with threat. Expertise for now is still quite bugged on TrueWoW so you can somewhat ignore it, but if it's ever fixed in ICC it will be the go-to secondary stat if you want to match red sockets, depending on the rest of your expertise from gear. If you really need threat, go with stamina/strength -- strength gives a lot of threat, and also increases your mitigation from block by a bit.
Yellow socket: Stamina/hit IF you are below the hit cap, but above the defense cap. Big threat boost, and defense (avoidance) is quite meh.
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benzviliran
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#9 » Post by benzviliran » 20 Feb 2016 19:24

Maybe i didnt notice that he was looking for rhcs tanking only, however i think i mentioned belendor as an end game for raids, also being able to tank at raids should be more then enough for rhcs i believe.

also i said some builds (both talents and items) are not as good as others for some bosses, each boss might have different requirement simply like sindragosa in icc where you might want more frost resist and if you are a dk even that talent that increases your frost resist just for example.

anyway dont want to confuse our friend too much, he want to keep with aggro in rhcs? simply the gear and build belendor is using more then enough.

however i believe its not all about gear and in some cases you might have to also change your play style, for example since prot pala gets most of his mana regen from divine plea i think in some dungeons you might want to always keep it active untill the cd is over, for example in forge of souls you might want to hit critters(spiders etc) 1 time between every group of monsters so that your divine plea will not fade, you can also keep running to the next group while having 1 monster from before chasing you and hit it with judgement once before its fading and before reaching the next group of monsters and same idea in every dungeon.

also as your gear might also be low you might want to consider not using much consecration, can also consider maxing the retri talent "benediction", also some groups are not very helpfull (such as warriors groups/rogues etc) and you might not benefit from any mana regeneration or mana bonuses that you can benefit from such as mage retri pala shadow priest/disc priest etc.

also make sure to use righteuss defense which is an instant taunt of 3 hostile enemies from 1 of your party members, also if your dpsers are dps whores as you say you should maybe have them on focus and just focus on attacking their target to keep up with the aggro.

hoping it will help you, however you must understand that in rhcs its much more easier to steal aggro then raids.

gl
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Wilcox
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#10 » Post by Wilcox » 20 Feb 2016 20:11

mate.your problems will be solved with gear, that is all

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Xeye

Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#11 » Post by Xeye » 21 Feb 2016 06:39

Wilcox wrote:mate.your problems will be solved with gear, that is all
Probably, but until I get my skills to the proper levels I won't attempt raids, so this is about the best i'm going to have for a while.


Thank you everyone for the replies and suggestions. I'll get to testing and see what works for me.

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Koriach
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#12 » Post by Koriach » 21 Feb 2016 09:46

You don't need to not attempt raids. You can always start as an off-tank until you are comfortable enough to try and be a main tank but like others said with the right gear and rotation and people not bursting before you even get to hit the boss you should be fine.

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Wilcox
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#13 » Post by Wilcox » 21 Feb 2016 10:35

trust me raid bosses are much easier than it is to tank adds lol. there is a certain way of doing everything and honestly you can fail once, maybe twice but 3. time you'll eventually get the hang of things. after all in pve you know what the mobs will do in the following X seconds, it's artifical intelligence

tanking is cool

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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#14 » Post by Rascall » 21 Feb 2016 14:27

Not much to add to the tips, i guess all was mentioned. With better gear you will overcome your problems. Make sure you are hit and expertise capped, if so gem strength. Use Omen meter to see aggro and if needed hand of salvation on highest dpser (though those button smashers should watch their own aggro by default). Maybe, instead of tanking weapon use some 1h dps weapon for a start. But with higher gear it´s unlikely that you will have aggro issues.
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Re: LF Tankadin mentor. Need some tips.

#15 » Post by Gnurg » 21 Feb 2016 14:47

Crits deal a lot more threat. I tend to switch out tank gear with DPS gear that gives crit chance aslong as I keep defense above 550.
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