Problems & Solutions In PvP

[Intervention]

Shadow Priest:
Problem: Big one
Solution: Run the hell away

Hahaha.

The pushback from fearing the gargoyle can be too intense and to change to concentration aura is just 1 more GCD too many and you're dead. Unless of course, you get glyph of turn evil, but c'mon, that glyph is too situational for my liking.

Also for the Frost Mage, if you can't get near him, try beat up on his pet if he has it out to get your art of war up and some healing/mana from your judgements. If you're lucky, you can starve the priest of mana so much that he is forced to evocate, he'll most likely poly you at this point, so i always try to save my trinket for this part of the fight because it takes a lot of effort to get them low on mana, if you can't trinket that polymorph or simply stop the evocate somehow, you're sad to say, screwed.

[Cyrius]

Also for the Frost Mage, if you can't get near him, try beat up on his pet if he has it out to get your art of war up and some healing/mana from your judgements. If you're lucky, you can starve the priest of mana so much that he is forced to evocate, he'll most likely poly you at this point, so i always try to save my trinket for this part of the fight because it takes a lot of effort to get them low on mana, if you can't trinket that polymorph or simply stop the evocate somehow, you're sad to say, screwed.

[/quote]

Da F*ck???

Anyway on topic, I agree with all Diryn said, he gave some great tips! I also agree with what Inter sais about the mages pet. Good thing about hitting the pet is mana and art of war proc since he doesnt have a shield and stuff, problem is the fact that some mages recall their pats so they get outta range many times, also the water elemental doenst have that much hp and he goes downt pretty fast. There is no real way to kill these 3 clases Dyrin mentioned as a paladin, but the tips he gave are more then enough to help you survive in bg or arena long enoungh for your team m8ts to come kill them and to start t-Bagging and flipping them off.

I tell you some of the things i used to do, they might help those of you who play with SoCom (mostly bgs and duels, definetly not good for arena). This is something that is helpful against all 3 (SPs, Frost mages and locks) and its swaping to holy 1 hander and shield when they are kitting you, mainly cuz it increases your Spell power and with it the amount of dmg the Judgements do. In addition, since you are with SoComm you also have more defence if you choose Divine guardian and Imp Rfury. Now swapping the weapons in combat wastes an additional GCD so you gotta be careful with it. Anyway the thing with seal of com is that you are gona try make the enemy waste his CDs/mana 1st and then kill him, cuz if you rush in for the kill you gona fail due to the lack of dmg. Try it , it worked for me back in the day.

and sorry for the long post

[Diryn]

yes soc spec is clearly better against mage and priest but idk how you can make them go oom. Ofc if they can't play you can but what if they steal or remove every art of the war and buff? You won't be able to survive until they get oom and you will always be oom before them because of absorbs effect.
And using shield makes it even harder to break their absorbs they can easily put a new just after you break it because not enough damage. dps the pet is good also but i use it more on arena cos i can los the mage while doing that, in duel you still take damage and it will die quite fast anyway.

For weapon switch, you can avoid the gcd if you pick it just after using a spell: the switch ignore spells gcd so you can change at any time but it always add a full gcd just after changing. You can make a macro that use flash + equip shield for example but you have to click it when there is no current gcd.
With some practise you can synchronise it so that there is nearly no gcd at all.

[Cyrius]

yes soc spec is clearly better against mage and priest but idk how you can make them go oom. Ofc if they can't play you can but what if they steal or remove every art of the war and buff? You won't be able to survive until they get oom and you will always be oom before them because of absorbs effect.
And using shield makes it even harder to break their absorbs they can easily put a new just after you break it because not enough damage. dps the pet is good also but i use it more on arena cos i can los the mage while doing that, in duel you still take damage and it will die quite fast anyway.

For weapon switch, you can avoid the gcd if you pick it just after using a spell: the switch ignore spells gcd so you can change at any time but it always add a full gcd just after changing. You can make a macro that use flash + equip shield for example but you have to click it when there is no current gcd.
With some practise you can synchronise it so that there is nearly no gcd at all.

Yes, you have a point in the Weapons swap. As for the oom part, with SoCom i usualy have the glyph aswell so even if the judgement gets absorbed then ,yes, the talent wont take place, but the glyph will work as it restores 8% every time a judgement is casted, not every time a judgement hits. Against bad players it is not that hard to get them oom, as you said, and then kill them, but if he spellsteals EVERY or even MOST art of wars then he must be realy good. The problem with that is he will go oom very fast just because he is overusing spellsteal. But then again, even if he goes oom that doesnt garanty you will win, there is still mana gem and evoc. As i said before, SoC wont help you kill him, but it will prolong the inevitable just as long for backup to show up or your partner to take him down, that is ...if he is still alive.

Also you are right about the absorb effects , the shields are still a problem.

Now to change the class subject a little, most of you probly know i also have a fire mage alt. I want to apologise to Disc for not sticking to the format, but insted of posting more text, i thought it would be easier to show you the guide i am learning fire from:

http://bebep.pureforum.net/t533-fire-ma ... uide-wotlk

this guide is awesome , totaly legit and at the bottom if you noticed it mentiones all trouble classes and how to deal with them.

[Diryn]

Well if you play against a mage you will hardly even break the ice barrier and without art of the war don't proc when your hit are absorbed. You won't be able to proc a single aow if he knows what to do, it's not even about dispelling lol and it goes very fast. With my mage i beat geared paladins in 20 sec max they can't proc a single aow, i only have to steal sacred shield and hand of freedom it doesn't need much skilled like you said.

Nice guide btw i just wouldn't use those mouseover macro for poly because it's not really safe if the opponent move and you might lose some time if it fails. The focus macro is better or arena1 arena2 one.

[Arashikage]

Well the Spriest situation can be eased if you have enough burst to make them panic and use disperse. During the disperse you can cleanse, shield, heal up and prepare your follow up. But i tend to cleanse a lot v/s a lot of casters. The main reason i oom when i do is solely because of cleanse.

[Gorka]

I am Drpain (Arm warr).

Destruction Warlock
Problems: Fear spam underground bug, incredible damage, pet seduction, anoying kiting
Solutions: Charge, bladestorm at first to avoid cc, when he teleport, stop bladestorming fast and use intercept, spell reflect, interrupt casting, do evertything to survive and stay at melee range, allways keep harmstring and try to reflect or interrupt chaos bolt at all cost.

Unholy Death Knight
Problem: Chain of ice, death strike, anoying kiting and incredible survivability on 1v1
Solution: Allways keep mortal strike up, retaliation + bladestorm + enraged regen and disarm him when hes low on health, try to reflect chain of ice as much as possible.....but i dont see any real good solution to beat a skilled dk on 1v1 xD

Rogue
Problem: Chain stun that last forever, crazy damage, dismish in middle of a combat
Solution: When you get stuned, trinket and shield wall (must be done in less than a second too) the rogue will prolly run away to not waste his time and stuns trying to kill a warrior with 60% dmg reduction, if not, let him waste his stun, if he dont use his stun, get rend on, and use shield block to do revenge on him, after that disarm him and go battle stance and charge + overpower till he die (dont use disarm if he is using his avoiding ability, you will just miss it). Dont forget to use enraged regen because a rogue can get your health to low very fast.

[Fivecapz]

trinket cheap shot and pop shield wall. worst idea.

rogue can just kite you then, and reopen easy, and after the opener when you're half health, just blind you, and use another opener, and you're pretty much dead - geared rogues who can output alot of damage i mean.

[Justicelight]

Arashikage best way to burst a spriest is while they do dispersion. Use wings when they dispersion and watch them die. Never hold on if you have wings ready and he disperses.

[Gorka]

Geared rogue will kill you in the chain stun if you dont do anything. If you dont trink you will loose all your health in a couple of seconds and wont be able to do anything, I think disarming the rogue could work but most of the time when you turn on the rogue, he use evade ability and you miss the disarm. If you use BS you get disarmed and you are bretty much screwed, if you use retaliation you get blinded/kited...... so when you use shield block and shield wall (not at the same time) be sure to use harmstring or the aoe slow, its all about timing and witch tactic the rogue is using, there is no real easy way to beat a geared and skilled rogue.

You could....trink--->disarm---->bladestorm--->(the rogue will now vanish and run, and reapear because of the bleeding tick)-->stop BS and charge, .....etc with a varity of possible way depending on what the rogue is doing

[Discarnate]

So far, the safest option I found vs rogues could be put under two circumstances; one where you're aware of him and another where you're not.

When you know a Rogue may attack you, immediately switch to 1H+shield. Do not use Berserker Rage to break Sap. He'll just wait it out and re-Sap you. It's better to save it for Gouge. Anyway, on to the actual strategy:

When he Cheap Shots you, most naturally he'll Kidney Shot very soon. Never ever trinket the Cheap Shot. In arena, it's better not to trinket anything except for Blind in most cases, but duels aren't the same. Anyway, once he Kidney Shots you, as Gorka said, if you don't do anything about it, your HP will dip too low, and the Rogue will Dismantle you to prevent Shield Wall and kill you in the open. Trinket the Kidney Shot, immediately (hit 1H+shield macro if you weren't aware and/or) turn around and put a Rend on him. It must be done instantly. Since it's a duel and it has no healer, getting an MS off isn't the first priority. Try to get an Overpower or two from this and immediately Bladestorm while your HP is still above 80%. Naturally, the Rogue will Dismantle you. Once he does, use Intimidating Shout, use Intercept instead of Charge back to him for a longer stun. Put Rend and hit a big Mortal Strike on him with a Hamstring.

Remember, Rogues die in a few hits. But, you just gotta land the hits. An interesting game mechanism to remember in these things -- a stunned target loses all ability to dodge. You know what that means. I know what that means.

Anyway, after that, just try to sorta tank him going back to your 1H+shield. Even if he manages to defeat you, the duel will be a close one. Also, Retaliation on a Rogue without Evasion is murder. Just murder.

Hope, I helped.

[Fivecapz]

once he Kidney Shots you, as Gorka said, if you don't do anything about it, your HP will dip too low, and the Rogue will Dismantle you to prevent Shield Wall and kill you in the open. Trinket the Kidney Shot, immediately (hit 1H+shield macro if you weren't aware and/or) turn around and put a Rend on him. It must be done instantly. Since it's a duel and it has no healer, getting an MS off isn't the first priority. Try to get an Overpower or two from this and immediately Bladestorm while your HP is still above 80%. Naturally, the Rogue will Dismantle you. Once he does, use Intimidating Shout, use Intercept instead of Charge back to him for a longer stun. Put Rend and hit a big Mortal Strike on him with a Hamstring.



not the best idea, since good kiters wont let you get intercept off, or even a rend off, and they'll just kite you for days, or just do something to hold you in place and run to africa, to prevent you from trinketing or exactly FOR the trinket, when you can trinket and charge the rogue, but then the rogue shadowsteps, and you waste your charge/intercept.

[Discarnate]

once he Kidney Shots you, as Gorka said, if you don't do anything about it, your HP will dip too low, and the Rogue will Dismantle you to prevent Shield Wall and kill you in the open. Trinket the Kidney Shot, immediately (hit 1H+shield macro if you weren't aware and/or) turn around and put a Rend on him. It must be done instantly. Since it's a duel and it has no healer, getting an MS off isn't the first priority. Try to get an Overpower or two from this and immediately Bladestorm while your HP is still above 80%. Naturally, the Rogue will Dismantle you. Once he does, use Intimidating Shout, use Intercept instead of Charge back to him for a longer stun. Put Rend and hit a big Mortal Strike on him with a Hamstring.



not the best idea, since good kiters wont let you get intercept off, or even a rend off, and they'll just kite you for days, or just do something to hold you in place and run to africa, to prevent you from trinketing or exactly FOR the trinket, when you can trinket and charge the rogue, but then the rogue shadowsteps, and you waste your charge/intercept.

Well, yeah, it's based on people's mistakes really. If the Rogue dead-zone kites you, you're gonna be in for a lot of trouble. Trying to land a Piercing Howl is your best option in those moments. Dead-zone kiting is very painful and often has no remedy since he'll close the gap as soon as you try to create distance for a Charge/Intercept.

So, it's really about the little things. Did Dismantle get dodged? Did your Piercing Howl land? Did his dead-zone kiting leave you some room for a Charge/Intercept? Did your MS get dodged? Did you miss your Rend? Etc.

Some additional information: Going 1H + shield isn't always gonna save our bottoms when we fight Mutilate Rogues since the lion share of their damage is magical. Although, a well timed Shield Block can keep you alive for much longer. We cannot hope for a Revenge session though. That almost always fails vs any spec of Rogues.

So, yeah.

[Fivecapz]

agree that skillvenom rogues do way too much damage vs warriors with 1h/shield out, its kind of retarded how much they can burst, but, that is kind of ballanced for low geared players, for not getting globaled by people with full wrath in arenas, like me, i play with 612 resilience, and i cand even touch anyone with higher than 1,2 pieces of WF gear, so i just go skillvenom, and win that way.


but yeah, i think you can beat rogues pretty easy as a warrior, if the rogue is as stupid as some people that live in this server. for example, rogues who dont know how to kite, open with ambush followed by a kidney after like 1,2 secs, which gives you plenty of time to get a rend, overpower on them.

but if the rogue is good, then thats half rng game really, you could always just bladestorm/cancel aura to get a rend off on him, when he's trying to kite you, but do it after he shivs you, in the same GCD he does it, so he doesnt have time to dismantle you, and is forced to use evasion, to stay alive, since the bladestorm ticks are lethal for most of the rogues ( atleast for me 3 ticks is certain death.) but if the rogue waits it out, and doesnt pop evasion right away, and dismantles you, thats not as bad as you might think, you can just go back defencive, and try to reaply the rend thats still ticking on the rogue.

(this is only about sub rogues)

[Discarnate]

agree that skillvenom rogues do way too much damage vs warriors with 1h/shield out, its kind of retarded how much they can burst, but, that is kind of ballanced for low geared players, for not getting globaled by people with full wrath in arenas, like me, i play with 612 resilience, and i cand even touch anyone with higher than 1,2 pieces of WF gear, so i just go skillvenom, and win that way.


but yeah, i think you can beat rogues pretty easy as a warrior, if the rogue is as stupid as some people that live in this server. for example, rogues who dont know how to kite, open with ambush followed by a kidney after like 1,2 secs, which gives you plenty of time to get a rend, overpower on them.

but if the rogue is good, then thats half rng game really, you could always just bladestorm/cancel aura to get a rend off on him, when he's trying to kite you, but do it after he shivs you, in the same GCD he does it, so he doesnt have time to dismantle you, and is forced to use evasion, to stay alive, since the bladestorm ticks are lethal for most of the rogues ( atleast for me 3 ticks is certain death.) but if the rogue waits it out, and doesnt pop evasion right away, and dismantles you, thats not as bad as you might think, you can just go back defencive, and try to reaply the rend thats still ticking on the rogue.

(this is only about sub rogues)

Mutilate damage doesn't change at all with a shield out. So, yeah. Mutilate is pretty scary except for one thing. If you can lay your hands on it for a few seconds, random globalling happens. Sub doesn't have that problem, thanks to Cheat Death.

But, yeah, with bad gear, Mutilate is definitely the best choice. No ArP is needed and stuff.