[TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

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Roel
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[TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#1 » Post by Roel » 31 Mar 2020 00:58

Greetings,

I'd like to take this time to personally apologize for the recent string of crashes on Saturday and Sunday. As you may have noticed, our population has finally been going into the triple digits. Last Sunday, we hit 104 online. This Saturday, it was 106 and on Sunday, we hit 109 online players.

As I'm sure you're aware, the more players there are, the more activity there is going on - be it PvE or PvP. As more content is being run with all their complex scripts in operation, bugs inevitably reveal themselves - bugs that are usually not known unless someone specifically runs some content that could have it. The complexity of any activity is often eclipsed by the complexity of its code. Unfortunately, such complexity inherently tends to have flaws as well. After all, we're only human. And code is man-made.

The recent crashes we experienced were due to code from TrinityCore that is quite ancient by current standards. This ancient code couldn't be debugged unless we had adequate data from our crash logs. Sometimes it takes multiple attempts to diagnose and properly fix such issues.

However, Andriuspel, Natnat, Doctor_J and Heihachi are constantly doing their level best to stay on top of each issue that comes up. Bear in mind, they do this while also keeping up with the constant stream of reports on the bug tracker, our private Trello issue tracker (and several other places). At the same time, their regular duties (internal maintenance, tickets, development) are also a constant load whenever real-life permits them to carry them out.

With that being said, I'd like to take a moment to share some new developments with you all.

For the past several years, our previous update system revolved around a weekly schedule. We updated the server every Wednesday, for all realms. This process involved compiling the core on the server itself. Some of you may be aware that as our population declined, it became unfeasible for us to continue operating on our old host that was intended for a much larger load and population. Thus, when we downsized to a more economical and feasible host, our capacity to put heavy loads on the server was slightly diminished. Unfortunately, this meant that whenever we compiled the core on the server, the realms would usually lag a bit until the core was finished building. As such, doing daily updates would have meant lagging the realms daily just to keep everything up to date.

However, those days are now long gone. For more than 6 months now, we have been operating on a new system called Deployment. It was developed and implemented by none other than our brilliant and gifted administrator, Heihachi. Deployment is a system that allows us to off-load all compiles to an external server. This external server runs an identical copy of TrueWoW, PrimalWoW and the PTR. So, whenever we compile the core with new updates, they are handled on the build server, not the server that the realms are hosted on. This means that the realms don't lag at all due to absolutely no external loads being placed on it other than its normal operations. This new system allowed us to discard our old weekly update schedule and change over to a daily or semi-daily update schedule instead.

Additionally, Heihachi has also shifted our entire operations from IRC to Discord as well as integrated Discord into our server itself. Since compile lag is no longer a factor, thanks to Deployment, our developers can commit core fixes at any given time straight from Discord itself. They are free to request an update and/or request a compile. This said request can then be approved by our staff's Quartermaster, Axis, or any available Administrator. The approval of any new updates is as easy as a simple chat command that can be entered via the Desktop or Mobile version of the Discord app.

Here is an example of how these new systems allowed us to handle the recent crash crises on TW realm this past weekend:
In case any of the 3 realms ever crash, the staff is automatically pinged with the crash log attached to the time and date of the crash. Developers can quickly view the attached log, analyze it for issues and commit a fix as soon as time allows. Once the crash fix is approved by the appropriate personnel, compiles begin for both live realms and the PTR realms via the deployment system. Once they are deployed, any GM, Dev or Admin can order a server restart from Discord and the update goes live immediately thereafter.

This new system also allows our GMs, Devs and Admins to perform other server related tasks as well, such as answering tickets, making announcements, monitoring security feeds and various in-game chat channels, etc - all from the convenience of the staff section of Discord. For example, when players submit a ticket in-game, the entire staff is automatically pinged on Discord with the ticket, the name of the player who submitted it and the realm they did it from. Depending on the nature of the issue, concern or question submitted in the ticket, GMs are free to answer the ticket either by logging into the game on their GM character, or by submitting a response directly from Discord on their PC or their phone. The convenience, efficiency, and ease of operations that this transition has allowed us compared to our previous IRC system cannot be understated - this effectively allows our staff to respond to and/or deal with situations/issues on our server without having to be online in-game or on the website all the time. The result is faster response times and in turn, a player base that is free from the burdens of being underserved or overlooked in their time of need.

We sincerely hope that the development and changes to our backend and support systems have contributed to a more efficient and satisfactory handling of your tickets, issues, concerns and/or questions. It is our goal that every player receives the best service and support we have to offer as they make a home for themselves on our humble server. If you have any suggestions or comments you'd like to make, please do feel free to let us know.

Thank you all for your boundless patience and support.
With our very best regards,
TrueWoW Staff

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Orochy
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#2 » Post by Orochy » 31 Mar 2020 02:16

Very informative, thank you for the explanation!
I have nothing but praise and appreciation for the TWStaff with all they've done!
In 8 years of playing here, with full gratitude for all previous staff, i can say this team we got is the most consistent, fast with tickets and precise with daily updates both in-game, on TW Discord and Andi always informing in HR Discord as well, +a bunch of jokesters once they have free time to have fun in Dala! ^_^
Thank you very much for all your hard work!!! :!:
Sincerely,
Senior Officer of <Hellraisers> :D

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Seveno5
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#3 » Post by Seveno5 » 31 Mar 2020 14:07

Since march 2011 I enjoy WoW here on TrueWoW.
Thank you TrueWoW Staff for all the energy and work that you (have) put into this wonderful server.
Keep up the good work 8-)

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Kniteknite
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#4 » Post by Kniteknite » 02 Apr 2020 19:56

Seveno5 wrote:
31 Mar 2020 14:07
Since march 2011 I enjoy WoW here on TrueWoW.
Thank you TrueWoW Staff for all the energy and work that you (have) put into this wonderful server.
Keep up the good work 8-)
+1mil~ Thanks again for being around, Your dedication, and consideration Everyone gets the hiccups every once and a while ;) ~ cheers~
" French fries are like steaks, where the potato is the cow and gets cut up, like meat does, only on a smaller scale. "

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ggsmith79
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#5 » Post by ggsmith79 » 03 Apr 2020 11:15

thanks for the staffs who are putting us on knowledge of the causes of these damn issues
old player linked to old server creates a strong connections and energies ..
thanks a lot for your efforts and go on :D :D

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Dreadnought101
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#6 » Post by Dreadnought101 » 03 Apr 2020 19:29

So what does this mean for Primalwow when it goes to wrath? It is possible that Primal can gain a large population again. Can the servers handle it?

I also find that using discord to report bugs disappointing as GMs who are not even part of the development team are very rude and scoff that we should be using the clunky bugtracker system on a website and may ignore bug reports entirely. Other Private Servers have picked up on the trend of using Discord for reporting bugs and is becoming the norm. What has ended up happening on Truewow/Primalwow is that we are using 3rd party discord servers that are separate from the official Discord server in order to communicate with the development team directly and resolve bugs/issues or at least communicate the position and important of the bug to be fixed later which has been a great thing for players and developers, but this is only for those that are on those 3rd party discord servers, I am concerned about players who do not have access to those 3rd party servers who will report bugs and end up having their bugs dismissed and/or be discomfited.
Degaris
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A wise man once introduced me to this game "It shall protect your virginity my lad." He said...

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andriuspel
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#7 » Post by andriuspel » 03 Apr 2020 19:57

people till this day can't get idea why bug tracker was made... and well, we want to store reports on our platform rather than risking on discord services. I want to note, discord isn't fully rialable source to use for issues reporting since discord server is not hosted in our systems and could hang by any moment (there was a lot cases where discord services puked due of cloudflare issues).

Secondly, do you imagine how messy reports would go through discord? its like i'm spamming whole list of issues and lately overspamming details to each issues at random time...

And yes, core will be able to handle, we're working on stability and your comment that we're ignoring issues is brutal... We care about issue that much as how players cares to fill report about it.
A son asked his father (a programmer) why the sun rises in the east, and sets in the west. His response? It works, don’t touch!

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Dymond
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#8 » Post by Dymond » 03 Apr 2020 20:00

First of all, reporting legitimate bugs on the bug report is the best way to get them resolved. I, Myself have reported issues that have been immediately resolved or soon after. Major issues are always addressed first. As for "Disappoint GM's" I assume I fall under that class, if the Development team tried resolved every issue via discord, they would never have time to truly act as devs.
"Grief is the price we pay for love."

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Axis
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#9 » Post by Axis » 03 Apr 2020 20:21

Dreadnought101 wrote:
03 Apr 2020 19:29
So what does this mean for Primalwow when it goes to wrath? It is possible that Primal can gain a large population again. Can the servers handle it?

I also find that using discord to report bugs disappointing as GMs who are not even part of the development team are very rude and scoff that we should be using the clunky bugtracker system on a website and may ignore bug reports entirely. Other Private Servers have picked up on the trend of using Discord for reporting bugs and is becoming the norm. What has ended up happening on Truewow/Primalwow is that we are using 3rd party discord servers that are separate from the official Discord server in order to communicate with the development team directly and resolve bugs/issues or at least communicate the position and important of the bug to be fixed later which has been a great thing for players and developers, but this is only for those that are on those 3rd party discord servers, I am concerned about players who do not have access to those 3rd party servers who will report bugs and end up having their bugs dismissed and/or be discomfited.
Degaris,

I know for a fact that your post was aimed at me (and possibly another two GMs that have dealt with you, while I've spoken with you multiple times about this).

Andrius and Natnat (along with others on the team) have had to remind you several times to use the bugtracker.
We've told you time and time again to stop using #general / #support channels as an "official" place to report bugs, seeing as you often did it to skip proper procedure and just say things like, "Hey this is bugged, thought I'd report it here".
You're fully aware of the fact that everyone should be using it but here you are complaining about it instead.
And before I go further, we are NOT concerned the procedures or lack of procedures from other servers.
Your concern for players not having access to private guild Discord servers isn't valid.
Every player creates a forum account before they create their game account.
The same forum account is used to access the account manager.
The very same account manager is used to enable access to the bug tracker.
The bugtracker can be accessed using the forum account's username and password.
There really is no way to screw up remembering this unless a player is just careless.

The communications we maintain with the active guilds of TW/PW on their guild Discord servers (in this case, with Hellraisers, Sanctuary and Recycled) is a mere convenience and privilege, not an actual service.
This can be stopped at any time if we deem it necessary to make players follow proper procedure for reporting issues (as opposed to them spamming our Developers via PM or via pings on their own guild's Discord server and expecting an immediate fix to be prioritized over everything else).
Coincidentally, Andriuspel and Natnat happen to be members of Hellraisers and Recycled, respectively.
Neither of them have anonymous identities as players, so communicating with players on their guild Discord suits them just fine, as long as players still adhere to procedures.

Seeing as you're quite misinformed about the involvement of GMs with the Developers, I will clarify:
For your information, I happen to be closely involved with the Developers in the sense that just about every fix goes through me in order to be deployed to the live servers; the only other personnel who can approve them are the administrators themselves (Roel, Jiranthos or Heihachi - and those three are quite busy so this responsibility falls to me).
In addition, I work on a daily basis with our players who report issues to us regularly and test new fixes for said issues.
Furthermore, I also happen to manage the bugtracker alongside Errorista. Seeing as I am in daily (or one could say, even hourly) contact with the developers, I'm aware of almost every new report that comes in. And if I know, then the Devs know.

It's quite insulting to hear that you're under the impression that Devs are the only ones involved with the development of the server. GMs are often the first point of contact between the Devs and the players because issues often come up in-game and it is the GMs who answer the tickets for them. They subsequently inform the Devs thereafter. They also fill in as testers for bugs and fixes quite often.
To make it perfectly crystal clear, there is no separate "development team" - just to dispel that false notion.
We are one team with a single purpose: the improvement and growth of our servers. Nothing more, nothing less.

It isn't difficult at all to access our bugtracker, nor use it for that matter.
And calling it clunky is laughable at best. Wait till you see the issue tracker that TrinityCore has.
Discord happens to be a 3rd party service. Whenever there's an outage, every Discord server in the world is affected by it. This hinders operations and isn't acceptable.
It also doesn't allow us to store, categorize, search or isolate reports properly (The CTRL F search function isn't enough). In short, Discord isn't even on the same level as Mantis or Gitlab/Github. They can't be compared at all because they serve different purposes.
You're basically comparing apples to watermelons.
Our Mantis bugtracker makes handling of reports a breeze, whether it comes to reporting new ones, browsing though current ones or sorting/searching through old ones.

The fact that you consider it rude for us to remind players, such as yourself, to follow proper procedure and not turn our Discord's chat channels into a bugtracker is just absurd.
Your statement that we do not take certain issues seriously simply because procedures aren't followed is also quite preposterous.
The height of hubris here is you implying that Discord "reports" should be taken at face value and that communication with our Devs via a guild's own private Discord is the only way to get them to be aware of certain issues.
Discord "reports" often lack any evidence whatsoever, such as screenshots or videos, details from Wowhead/Wowpedida/Wowwiki/Retail (and NOT other private servers) or other retail 3.3.5a documentation.

Stability is paramount. It will always take priority over everything else.
Any issues that are specific to classes, content (dungeons/raids/BGs), quests, etc, etc are prioritized based on the severity of the problem they represent (and not just according to the interpretation of one GM/Dev but by the consensus of the active staff) and are dealt with accordingly. Some other important factors to consider are the complexity of the code involved, which is up to the Devs to decide, as well as the time and effort required to address them.

I don't usually go to such lengths to respond, but your blatantly misguided and uninformed post couldn't be allowed to go unaddressed.
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“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing.” - Edmund Burke.

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natnat123
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Re: [TW/PW] - A Word From the Founder & New Developments.

#10 » Post by natnat123 » 03 Apr 2020 23:24

As above ^ couldn't have said it better myself, you have been told multiple times to use the bug tracker. discord is not designed to be a bug tracker and will never work well as one unless the discord developers implement such a feature. There is no current discord feature that will Organise bugs, as well as Mantis, does. Mantis is also very easy to access. Discord is just the lazy way.

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